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 Post subject: Re: Ignorance is Bliss.
PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2018 3:33 am 
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Anthropoid wrote:
You are as tedious, pedantic and useless as you always were!

But seriously: the way you interact on this board reminds me regularly of why I detest the typical academic! I appreciate that :D

Ignorance is Bliss. ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Ignorance is Bliss.
PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2018 8:56 am 
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Relax, there are potential technological solutions.

--Global SO2 stratospheric injections
--Partial orbital IR filters
--Artificial ground level albedo devices
--Sub Arctic forrestation
--Bioengineering of friendly algae to fix carbon
--Build another Tsar Bomba to light off the Yellowstone Caldera

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 Post subject: Re: Ignorance is Bliss.
PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2018 9:01 am 
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Some are even cultural. Order all the good looking women to wear zinc oxide and go around naked. Hell, the men too. I don't care.

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 Post subject: Re: Ignorance is Bliss.
PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2018 10:56 am 
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Anthropoid wrote:
You are as tedious, pedantic and useless as you always were!

But seriously: the way you interact on this board reminds me regularly of why I detest the typical academic! I appreciate that :D


That's ok with me; real scholars don't seem to fond of you either, so it's only fair. :mrgreen:

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 Post subject: Re: Ignorance is Bliss.
PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2018 11:05 am 
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jack t ripper wrote:
Relax, there are potential technological solutions.

--Global SO2 stratospheric injections
--Partial orbital IR filters
--Artificial ground level albedo devices
--Sub Arctic forrestation
--Bioengineering of friendly algae to fix carbon
--Build another Tsar Bomba to light off the Yellowstone Caldera


Heh. Yeah. Fixes. Forestation will definitely capture some of the carbon, but first there will be a big exhalation of carbon when all the accumulated tundra begins to decay.

My read on things is this. It's too late to prevent 3 degrees centigrade global warming. Nothing we can do at this point will stop it. China and India, furthemore, have declared themselves exempt from concern over the problem and will continue to expand CO2 emissions, so probably we're heading for at least 5 degrees C global warming. Higher still if the effects on marine forams are worse than predicted because those little beasties account for a lot of carbon uptake.

A shit ton of people in Africa and Asia are going to starve. Wars between major powers are almost certain now.


1. The US needs to disengage from the places where those wars are likely.
2. The US needs to ramp up renewables because it's good for the US economically in the long run and good for US national security.
3. We can count on the US federal gov't to continue to be run by morons, so anything like planning is not going to happen until it is too late. Therefore:
4. States and households that come out of this OK will be the ones who take personal action to ensure their own security from the blowback from 1-3.

If Haemorroropoid wants to live in Camp Denial under his Tinfoil Tent I'm ok with him being eaten by the starving masses. He has a right to his uninformed opinion, to live by the expectations he draws from that opinion, and suffer the consequences when they happen.

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 Post subject: Re: Ignorance is Bliss.
PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2018 11:15 am 
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https://wattsupwiththat.com/2018/11/05/ ... undup-334/

The Skeptic Legions grow with each passing week, and your religion shrinks in corollary fashion . . .
Quote:
MIT Sloan Professor of Meteorology emeritus Richard Lindzen wrote TWTW stating that, in the past weeks, TWTW may have underemphasized the importance of clouds and overemphasized water vapor in their roles of causing climate change. Perhaps TWTW did because the role of El Niños in influencing atmospheric temperatures trends can easily be seen by looking at a graph of the entire record since December 1978. El Niños put a lot of water vapor into the air and temperatures peak quickly, then fall slowly as the moisture drops out. The influence is particularly strong in the Arctic, where there is little water vapor in the atmosphere. But the El Niño influence is not strong in the dry Antarctic, for reasons not clear.

Lindzen states that upper level cirrus clouds may have as great an influence as water vapor, and that poor model treatment of these clouds may be the main issue. (Cirrus clouds are the thin wispy ones composed of ice crystals occurring at altitudes between 16,500 feet (5 km) and 45,000 feet (8.5 km)). They can slow both incoming and outgoing radiant energy. In slowing outgoing radiant energy, they can have a significant greenhouse effect, causing the air to warm below them.

However, as Paul Homewood reminds us, a study by Clive Best and Euan Mearns showed a strong correlation between cloud cover and surface temperatures reported by the Hadley Center and the Climatic Research Unit (HADCRUT4) from July 1983 to December 2008 and corresponding cloud cover from the International Satellite Cloud Climatology Project (ISCCP). A decrease in total cloud cover (not just cirrus clouds) corresponded closely with an increase in temperatures. The researchers wrote:

“In conclusion, natural cyclic change in global cloud cover has a greater impact on global average temperatures than CO2. There is little evidence of a direct feedback relationship between clouds and CO2.”

Following Homewood’s post, on WUWT, Anthony Watts reminds us that former NASA senior climatologist Roy Spencer wrote on the role of clouds and temperatures in “The Great Global Warming Blunder: How Mother Nature Fooled the World’s Top Climate Scientists.”

“The most obvious way for warming to be caused naturally is for small, natural fluctuations in the circulation patterns of the atmosphere and ocean to result in a 1% or 2% decrease in global cloud cover. Clouds are the Earth’s sunshade, and if cloud cover changes for any reason, you have global warming — or global cooling.”

Of course, none of this is conclusive. However, it illustrates the simplistic thinking embodied in the reports of the UN Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC). The earth’s climate is the result of two dynamic fluids interacting with each other and the irregularly shaped land. The fluids are placed into chaotic motion by the earth’s rotation exposing the fluids and land to uneven warming by energy from the sun. All this is further complicated by changing exposure with the earth’s orbit around the sun, variation in the axis of rotation, variation in the energy emitted from the sun, and energy received by the earth from space. The IPCC attempting to explain changes in this complex system with changes of a bit player, carbon dioxide, is like attempting to explain a complex Shakespearian tragedy through the role of a minor character.

For generations, scholars have considered “King Lear’ to be Shakespeare’s greatest but least popular play. This work of genius challenges scholars for an understandable explanation. Trying to explain “King Lear” through the role of a minor character, such as Curan, is absurd. So is the effort to explain a brief period of climate change through the role of carbon dioxide. According to its web site, the IPCC has been operating for 30 years. It is time that it realizes its explanation is failing. See links under Challenging the Orthodoxy and Measurement Issues – Atmosphere.

*************

Quote of the Week: “Religion is a culture of faith; science is a culture of doubt.” ― Richard P. Feynman

Number of the Week: 8%

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 Post subject: Re: Ignorance is Bliss.
PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2018 11:21 am 
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and from the same site . . .
Quote:
*************

Importance of Verification: The University of Alabama, Huntsville (UAH), global temperature trend has been updated for October and posted on Roy Spencer’s web site. One reader noted a discrepancy between UAH data and the data from RSS (Remote Sensing Systems) and NOAA STAR (Center for Satellite Applications and Research), which show a greater warming trend than is shown in UAH data. John Christy responded to the comment as follows:

“Thank you for the comment. These differences have been noticed and discussed in our publications. For the latest, see Christy et al. 2018 IJRS https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10 ... 18.1444293



“You are correct in the differences over the period of NOAA-12 and NOAA-14. As discussed in the paper, as we perform an objective procedure relying on data from the non-drifting (at this time) and better-calibrated NOAA-15 to deal with some of the spurious warming in NOAA-14 whereas RSS and NOAA do not. They retain the warming of NOAA-14 relative to NOAA-15 which lifts their time series higher as you noticed. That is the main reason for the difference. As we show using radiosondes with consistent instrumentation, all satellites have relative warming vs. the sondes in this period, but UAH’s is much reduced due to our adjustment procedure. Note that the procedure was developed without any use of the radiosonde information.



“Here are the trend DIFFERENCES for 1979-2005 (period of MSU influence), tropics, satellite minus radiosondes (performed at radiosonde grid areas only). This from Table 3



UAH +0.045 +/- 0.066

RSS +0.116 +/- 0.070

NOAA +0.111 +/- 0.069

UW +0.117 +/- 0.069



“Similarly, for the satellite minus Reanalyses average. (full tropical coverage.)



UAH -0.008 +/- 0.039

RSS +0.066 +/- 0.049

NOAA +0.091 +/- 0.053

UW +0.064 +/- 0.040



“As you can see, UAH is insignificantly different from the other systems, whereas RSS, NOAA and UW are significantly warmer.

By comparing their data with data taken by other methods using different instruments, UAH was able to adjust for orbital drift, in time of day, which occurred with NOAA-14. Why RSS, NOAA STAR, and the University of Washington group (UW) do not adjust for the orbital drift is known only to them. In the 1990s RSS strongly criticized UAH for not adjusting its data for orbital decay.

The difference noted by Christy underscores the need for verification of calculations from one set of instruments with results from different sets of instruments. There may be some quibble as to which set of data better reflects the changing climate, but the main point is clear, the models are significantly overestimating the warming of the atmosphere, where the greenhouse gas effect occurs. See links under Measurement Issues – Atmosphere.

*************


If you are a "scientist" it shouldn't worry you that anyone doubts what you claim as gospel. In fact, you should WELCOME scrutiny, skepticism, comparing notes, and revealing of flaws in theory or method. THAT is what a scientist is: someone who is never satisfied with the current answers and always seeking to improve those answers.

Your Climate Change Religion defies these essential defining features of science and seeks to impose a moratorium on true scientific thinking and investigation by stigmatizes, dismissing, belittling and insulting anyone who asks too many questions as "denier" or otherwise foolish and ignorant.

Frankly, you as a person with a terminal degree, and a position in a putatively scientific profession should be deeply ashamed of yourself. I suppose given you have devoted years of your life to this faith, that is unlikely to ever happen, but that is the case.

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 Post subject: Re: Ignorance is Bliss.
PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2018 11:26 am 
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Quote:
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2018/11/05/ ... undup-334/


:lol: :lol: :lol: You got a link to an op ed written by the FLAT EARTH SOCIETY? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Ignorance is Bliss.
PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2018 11:30 am 
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If you are a "scientist" it shouldn't worry you that anyone doubts what you claim as gospel.


In fact it does NOT worry me. As I noted before, you're free to wallow in ignorance and live with the consequences. Me and others like me will choose a different path. But when the shtf refugees aren't going to be welcome.

Anthropogenic global warming is one of those interesting cases where the phenom fixes itself ultimately. I'm not the only climate scientist making plans to get through it ok when things go pear-shaped.

My *advice* to anyone reading this is to know what they're long range plans are for dealing with global warming and the things that spin off from it weather-wise, war-wise, or otherwise.

Feel free not to have a plan. Your coming travails ain't gonna be my problem to solve.

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 Post subject: Re: Ignorance is Bliss.
PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2018 12:04 pm 
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mdiehl wrote:
Quote:
If you are a "scientist" it shouldn't worry you that anyone doubts what you claim as gospel.


In fact it does NOT worry me. As I noted before, you're free to wallow in ignorance and live with the consequences. Me and others like me will choose a different path. But when the shtf refugees aren't going to be welcome.

Anthropogenic global warming is one of those interesting cases where the phenom fixes itself ultimately. I'm not the only climate scientist making plans to get through it ok when things go pear-shaped.

My *advice* to anyone reading this is to know what they're long range plans are for dealing with global warming and the things that spin off from it weather-wise, war-wise, or otherwise.

Feel free not to have a plan. Your coming travails ain't gonna be my problem to solve.


You seem pretty worried to me. :P

You also seem pretty tedious, pedantic, and useless when it comes to having an intelligent conversation, much less teaching anyone what you actually know, and heavens forbid anyone presume to teach AlMighty Midol anything. He is the holder of all the knowledge worth spouting after all!
Image

You do realize of course . . . well maybe you don't . . . many of the greatest scientist in human history held no faculty positions when they made their greatest contributions. You seem to think that membership in the academy is the gold standard for credibility and merit as far as scientific thinking goes. You are either a poor fool who has not woken up to the charade or just another asshole elitist. I lean toward the latter but you do seem to be mellowing slightly with age.

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