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 Post subject: Re: Fun Facts: Stuff to make German Armor Fans Cry.
PostPosted: Sat Sep 16, 2017 2:35 am 
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buck private
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Paul Van Riper
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Van_Riper

the wargame was Millennium Challenge 2002 (MC02

He did stir up a hornet's nest. 8-)

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 Post subject: Re: Fun Facts: Stuff to make German Armor Fans Cry.
PostPosted: Sat Sep 16, 2017 9:58 am 
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abradley wrote:
Paul Van Riper
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Van_Riper

the wargame was Millennium Challenge 2002 (MC02

He did stir up a hornet's nest. 8-)


Ah thanks!

Point being (which I think you do get Abrad): you do not have to have "the best" to win. You just have to use what you got smarter than the other guy uses what he gots.

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 Post subject: Re: Fun Facts: Stuff to make German Armor Fans Cry.
PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 4:39 am 
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Anthropoid wrote:
abradley wrote:
Paul Van Riper
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Van_Riper

the wargame was Millennium Challenge 2002 (MC02

He did stir up a hornet's nest. 8-)


Ah thanks!

Point being (which I think you do get Abrad): you do not have to have "the best" to win. You just have to use what you got smarter than the other guy uses what he gots.

Andy can provide interesting stuff occasionally.

I may disagree with him occasionally, but that is just normal.

If two persons agree on everything, that means that only one is thinking. ;)

So it goes.

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 Post subject: Re: Fun Facts: Stuff to make German Armor Fans Cry.
PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 7:12 am 
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nero wrote:
Andy can provide interesting stuff occasionally.

I may disagree with him occasionally, but that is just normal.

If two persons agree on everything, that means that only one is thinking. ;)

So it goes.
Malarkey, the only thing we agree on is ... Hang on I'll think of something.

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 Post subject: Re: Fun Facts: Stuff to make German Armor Fans Cry.
PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 1:27 pm 
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More of this shitty youtuber who won't use his own voice on his videos?

Completely ignore T-34's reliability issues etc., Russian stuff is the shit, Americans suck, their tanks suck, they did nothing, bla bla, I'm not using my own voice but stupid text to speech,

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 Post subject: Re: Fun Facts: Stuff to make German Armor Fans Cry.
PostPosted: Mon Sep 18, 2017 6:29 pm 
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Hadn't seen this before, in one of the comments.

20:00 on is a lot of specifics about Sherman vs German tanks, like; Who would win in a meeting engagement M4 vs Pz5, depends on who got the first shot, crew of the first shot are hi after the shot, the other crew would be shook up and likely miss. Who would get the first shot, most likely the Sherman with it's powered transverse.

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 Post subject: Re: Fun Facts: Stuff to make German Armor Fans Cry.
PostPosted: Mon Sep 18, 2017 7:31 pm 
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"powered transverse" what the hell is that?

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 Post subject: Re: Fun Facts: Stuff to make German Armor Fans Cry.
PostPosted: Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:24 pm 
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Anthropoid wrote:
"powered transverse" what the hell is that?
http://weaponsman.com/?p=19716
May not be using the right word, but:
Quote:
Getting on target faster. Here optics — including a good field of view for the gunner — and superior speed and control of main gun aim are the objective. If your turret slews very fast, that’s good, but not if the fast slew can’t produce fine control.
The Sherman had powered transverse of the turret, where most other armies were electrically cranked.
Quote:
# 15 Turrets: They Are The Combat Power Of The Tank
http://www.theshermantank.com/category/turret/

The T-34 was the fastest (12sec 360), M4 next (15sec), "The vaunted Panther tank had, in its first iteration (Panther Ausführung D), one of the slowest-turning turrets in the war, taking a full minute to traverse 360º. The gearing on the turret was changed in the Ausf. A, the next version, and all subsequent Panthers, giving the tank a competitive 15-second full-circle. But that didn’t last; a November, 1943 decision to govern the engine to a lower max RPM reduced slew rate to 18 seconds on Panthers from that point forward — if the crews didn’t learn about and adjust the governors. This was done to try to increase engine reliability: more Panthers were being lost to breakdowns than to Allied gunfire."One commenter "Both tanks had a power and a manual turret traverse, on the Panther the power traverse was never used because it didn’t work. On the Sherman the manual traverse was never used because the power one had such precision."
But these were fastest :o

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Even so, never go to a gunfight without a gun and, if you intend to win, never go to a religious war without religion. You'll lose.
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Last edited by abradley on Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Fun Facts: Stuff to make German Armor Fans Cry.
PostPosted: Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:29 pm 
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nero wrote:
Perhaps the doctrine having separate tank destroyers was not optimal, but it worked.


Well, it was promptly done away with after the war. The Americans could usually afford to attach a full (independent) tank battalion and in many cases a tank destroyer battalion to their infantry divisions. That is close to the AFV strength of a German late war Panzer Division.

Not convinced about the tank kills of Jabos. IIRC 2TAF alone claimed more tanks knocked out than were present in the West during Normandy 1944. (Source: Zetterling, N / Avgjoerandets oegonblick).
Jabos hurt the German supply system which of course had a major impact on their ability to wage mobile warfare though...


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 Post subject: Re: Fun Facts: Stuff to make German Armor Fans Cry.
PostPosted: Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:46 pm 
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Would hate to be the guy who had to scrape the dead guys out of those things.

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Anthro: Answer question #2: How do "Climate Change models" mathematically control for the natural forces which caused the Ice Age(s) to come and go . . . repeatedly?


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