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 Post subject: Re: Military stuff ... past and present.
PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 11:13 pm 
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What about a battle, what's the best depiction of a battle in a movie, I agree with the History Buff



Saw this long, long ago (pre computer days) and was amazed at the use of man power, history wise ... just knew a smattering of the history.

If you've seen it, see it again and glory in it's beauty, if slaughtering thousands can be beautiful. The charge of the Scots Grays is brilliantly done.

If you haven't seen it, do, and marvel at the director's ability control Rod Steiger.

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 Post subject: Re: Military stuff ... past and present.
PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2016 1:03 am 
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Ten 20th Century Military Rifles History Has Forgotten
http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2014 ... ry-rifles/

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 Post subject: Re: Military stuff ... past and present.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 6:03 am 
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Why were they bad ... First time I've had it explained.


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 Post subject: Re: Military stuff ... past and present.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 14, 2016 2:28 pm 
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abradley wrote:
Why were they bad ... First time I've had it explained.


Actually quite nice demonstration with nice acting. For me reading is enough to understand, especially with trivial cases like this.

Anyway a nice video, at least before the commercial.

Keep them coming.

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 Post subject: Re: Military stuff ... past and present.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 14, 2016 3:07 pm 
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abradley wrote:
Why were they bad ... First time I've had it explained.


Somebody said that the Germans had 3 groups of 1000 tanks when the French had 1000 groups of 3 tanks. That's why the Germans won.

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 Post subject: Re: Military stuff ... past and present.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 14, 2016 3:26 pm 
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LaPalice wrote:
abradley wrote:
Why were they bad ... First time I've had it explained.


Somebody said that the Germans had 3 groups of 1000 tanks when the French had 1000 groups of 3 tanks. That's why the Germans won.

True, but one man turret was another bad idea.

And then, not addressing LaPalice at all, but using this place, I announce that I was a shit head to be picky about a misspelling. That Gaugamela video was OK.

I will post here something interesting, and I hope that others will do so.

"Ilman sarvia ja hampaita" - "Without horns and Teeth".

Just for common interest.

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 Post subject: Re: Military stuff ... past and present.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 14, 2016 6:08 pm 
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nero wrote:
...
And then, not addressing LaPalice at all, but using this place, I announce that I was a shit head to be picky about a misspelling. That Gaugamela video was OK.

I will post here something interesting, and I hope that others will do so.

"Ilman sarvia ja hampaita" - "Without horns and Teeth".

Just for common interest.

And this should be in the History Buffs thread in the The Moving Picture Show forum. My bad completely.

That is what mushroom lasagna and Pinot Grigio does. :(

Anyway keep good stuff rolling...

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 Post subject: Re: Military stuff ... past and present.
PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2016 5:31 am 
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About the one man turret, knew commander was overworked ... but the explanation showed me how over worked he was.

As for the French soldier, he fought, but his leaders misused him
Quote:
Casualties[edit]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of ... Casualties

A German Military Medic providing first aid to a wounded soldier
German casualties are hard to determine but commonly accepted figures are: 27,074 killed, 111,034 wounded and 18,384 missing.[6][7][8] German dead may have been as high as 49,000 men, due to additional non-combat causes, wounded who died and missing who were confirmed dead.[6] The battle for France had cost the Luftwaffe 28 percent of its front line strength, some 1,236–1,428 aircraft were destroyed (1,129 to enemy action, 299 in accidents).[6] A further 323–488 were damaged (225 to enemy action, 263 in accidents), making 36 percent of the Luftwaffe strength lost or damaged.[15][6][10] Luftwaffe casualties amounted to 6,653 men, including 4,417 aircrew; of these 1,129 were killed and 1,930 were reported missing or captured, many of whom were liberated from French prison camps upon the French capitulation.[9] Italian casualties amounted to 631 or 642 men killed, 2,631 wounded and 616 reported missing. A further 2,151 men suffered from frostbite during the campaign. The official Italian numbers were compiled for a report on 18 July 1940, when many of the fallen still lay under snow and it is probable that most of the Italian missing were dead. Units operating in more difficult terrain had higher ratios of missing to killed but probably most of the missing had died.[12][13][14]

According to the Defence Historical Service, 85,310 French military personnel were killed (including 5,400 Maghrebis), 12,000 missing, 120,000 wounded and 1,540,000 prisoners (including 67,400 Maghrebis).[219] Some recent French research indicates that the number of killed was between 55,000 and 85,000.[7] In August 1940, 1,540,000 prisoners were taken into Germany, where roughly 940,000 remained until 1945, when they were liberated by advancing Allied forces. At least 3,000 Senegalese Tirailleurs were murdered after being taken prisoner.[220] While in German captivity, 24,600 French prisoners died; 71,000 escaped; 220,000 were released by various agreements between the Vichy government and Germany; several hundred thousand were paroled because of disability and/or sickness.[221] Air losses are estimated at 1,274 aircraft destroyed during the campaign.[222] Britain had fewer than 10,000 killed in action (including the Lancastria disaster), for a total casualty figure of 68,111 men; about 64,000 vehicles destroyed or abandoned and 2,472 guns destroyed or abandoned.[223] RAF losses in the campaign from 10 May – 22 June, amounted to 931 aircraft and 1,526 casualties. The British also lost 243 ships to Luftwaffe bombing in Dynamo, including 8 destroyers and 8 troopships.[223] Belgian losses were 6,093 killed and wounded; some 2,000 prisoners of war died in captivity and[224] more than 500 were missing.[225] Those captured amounted to 200,000 men.[226] Belgian wounded amounted to 15,850.[226] They also lost 112 aircraft.[227] Polish losses were around 5,500 killed and wounded; nearly 13,000 troops of the 2nd Infantry Division were interned in Switzerland for the duration of the war, and 16,000 were taken prisoner.[228]

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 Post subject: Re: Military stuff ... past and present.
PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2016 6:07 am 
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abradley wrote:
About the one man turret, knew commander was overworked ... but the explanation showed me how over worked he was.

As for the French soldier, he fought, but his leaders misused him
Quote:
Casualties[edit]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of ... Casualties

A German Military Medic providing first aid to a wounded soldier
German casualties are hard to determine but commonly accepted figures are: 27,074 killed, 111,034 wounded and 18,384 missing.[6][7][8] German dead may have been as high as 49,000 men, due to additional non-combat causes, wounded who died and missing who were confirmed dead.[6] The battle for France had cost the Luftwaffe 28 percent of its front line strength, some 1,236–1,428 aircraft were destroyed (1,129 to enemy action, 299 in accidents).[6] A further 323–488 were damaged (225 to enemy action, 263 in accidents), making 36 percent of the Luftwaffe strength lost or damaged.[15][6][10] Luftwaffe casualties amounted to 6,653 men, including 4,417 aircrew; of these 1,129 were killed and 1,930 were reported missing or captured, many of whom were liberated from French prison camps upon the French capitulation.[9] Italian casualties amounted to 631 or 642 men killed, 2,631 wounded and 616 reported missing. A further 2,151 men suffered from frostbite during the campaign. The official Italian numbers were compiled for a report on 18 July 1940, when many of the fallen still lay under snow and it is probable that most of the Italian missing were dead. Units operating in more difficult terrain had higher ratios of missing to killed but probably most of the missing had died.[12][13][14]

According to the Defence Historical Service, 85,310 French military personnel were killed (including 5,400 Maghrebis), 12,000 missing, 120,000 wounded and 1,540,000 prisoners (including 67,400 Maghrebis).[219] Some recent French research indicates that the number of killed was between 55,000 and 85,000.[7] In August 1940, 1,540,000 prisoners were taken into Germany, where roughly 940,000 remained until 1945, when they were liberated by advancing Allied forces. At least 3,000 Senegalese Tirailleurs were murdered after being taken prisoner.[220] While in German captivity, 24,600 French prisoners died; 71,000 escaped; 220,000 were released by various agreements between the Vichy government and Germany; several hundred thousand were paroled because of disability and/or sickness.[221] Air losses are estimated at 1,274 aircraft destroyed during the campaign.[222] Britain had fewer than 10,000 killed in action (including the Lancastria disaster), for a total casualty figure of 68,111 men; about 64,000 vehicles destroyed or abandoned and 2,472 guns destroyed or abandoned.[223] RAF losses in the campaign from 10 May – 22 June, amounted to 931 aircraft and 1,526 casualties. The British also lost 243 ships to Luftwaffe bombing in Dynamo, including 8 destroyers and 8 troopships.[223] Belgian losses were 6,093 killed and wounded; some 2,000 prisoners of war died in captivity and[224] more than 500 were missing.[225] Those captured amounted to 200,000 men.[226] Belgian wounded amounted to 15,850.[226] They also lost 112 aircraft.[227] Polish losses were around 5,500 killed and wounded; nearly 13,000 troops of the 2nd Infantry Division were interned in Switzerland for the duration of the war, and 16,000 were taken prisoner.[228]

you are right, a problem for the French was their command. The soldiers who panicked at Sedan, even without having seen the Germans, were reorganized, retaken in hand, with good leaders, and bravely fought along the Loire river, even if everything was already lost.

Your article speaks about the German aicrews captured by the French during the campaign and "given back" to the Germans. Many people said that it was a mistake, the French should have given them up to the British before the armistice.

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 Post subject: Re: Military stuff ... past and present.
PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2016 11:12 pm 
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