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 Post subject: Re: Hats off to Elon Musk
PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2018 8:32 pm 
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chijohnaok wrote:
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I also applaud him on finding a new way to get rid of his old car...so that it did not take up space in a landfill here on Earth.

And you say you wouldn't have accepted this "old" car for gratis. :lol:

Who's kidding who?

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 Post subject: Re: Hats off to Elon Musk
PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2018 8:58 pm 
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nero wrote:
chijohnaok wrote:
...
I also applaud him on finding a new way to get rid of his old car...so that it did not take up space in a landfill here on Earth.

And you say you wouldn't have accepted this "old" car for gratis. :lol:

Who's kidding who?



Nero, you need to visit an optician.

I never said anything of the sort.

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 Post subject: Re: Hats off to Elon Musk
PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2018 9:04 pm 
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chijohnaok wrote:
nero wrote:
...
And you say you wouldn't have accepted this "old" car for gratis. :lol:

Who's kidding who?



Nero, you need to visit an optician.

I never said anything of the sort.

I was reading between the lines. ;)

And jesting about Musk being too electrical for your taste. Not having coal powered boosters in his rockets. :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Hats off to Elon Musk
PostPosted: Thu Feb 08, 2018 7:27 am 
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From Deutsche Welle Website


Quote:
Tesla reported a fourth-quarter loss of $657 million (€535 million), up from $123 million in the same quarter a year earlier, making it the carmaker's biggest quarterly loss ever.

The company said it had struggled to meet production targets for its Model 3 sedan starting at $35,000.

Money-losing Tesla's long-term viability depends on annually selling billions of dollars of Model 3s. But production delays blamed on battery issues resulted in only 1,550 deliveries in the fourth quarter, far below the 4,100 vehicles expected by analysts.

Revenue from the highly anticipated model has yet to hit Tesla's bottom line.

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 Post subject: Re: Hats off to Elon Musk
PostPosted: Thu Feb 08, 2018 1:08 pm 
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chijohnaok wrote:
From Deutsche Welle Website


Quote:
Tesla reported a fourth-quarter loss of $657 million (€535 million), up from $123 million in the same quarter a year earlier, making it the carmaker's biggest quarterly loss ever.

The company said it had struggled to meet production targets for its Model 3 sedan starting at $35,000.

Money-losing Tesla's long-term viability depends on annually selling billions of dollars of Model 3s. But production delays blamed on battery issues resulted in only 1,550 deliveries in the fourth quarter, far below the 4,100 vehicles expected by analysts.

Revenue from the highly anticipated model has yet to hit Tesla's bottom line.


All the companies of the "new economy", if this term exists in English, lose money. I remember I posted something about Amazon losing money. Even Uber is concerned. At the beginning they don't win money. But many investors have confidence in theses companies.


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 Post subject: Re: Hats off to Elon Musk
PostPosted: Thu Feb 08, 2018 2:25 pm 
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Tesla brand loyalty is a version of environmentalist religious zeal. The virtue signalling (internally and externally to the consumer) are the primary reasons to purchase one.

Mostly this religious devotion is based on the Goreacle Church of the CO^2-oclasm, but in truth, that is not the only potential environmental benefit of a zero- or reduced-emissions vehicle. Clearly the shit that comes out the exhaust pipe of internal combustion engines IS toxic, hundreds if not thousands of noxious compounds in that shit. The evidence for the measurable impact of vehicle emissions on the well-being of biological systems in their midst is inescapable. However, the fact that trees in cities are distinctively less healthy than trees in the country or that children in inner city regions exhibit detectable uptick in incidence of asthma and other ailments does not make any of these "poisonous" effects significant, much less cataclysmic

Does the fact that an auto like a Tesla has zero emissions carry environmental and health benefits? Absolutely. Are they "significant?" Hard to say, possibly. Are they "revolutionary." That depends on the preceding question in part, but also on a range of other factors with the massive pollution-spewing nations called People's Republic of China and India being the big stinky elephants in the room . . .

And then we come to the unaddressed questions about the entire production life-cycle of a machine like a Tesla. The increased demand for lithium is and has been a boon for major lithium producing nations like Chile and China, so there is that. But the question is: what new or additional negative (or positive) environmental impacts are those major upswings in lithium harvesting and refining in those place resulting in?

The fact that the machines are largely assembled in the U.S. is a plus, but I seriously doubt that even 50% of the manufacturing of the components is occurring in the U.S. Regluations are too strict, prices are too high, margins are too thin. I may be wrong on that, but that is my speculation. Assuming that the Tesla procures much of its parts from foundries, refineries and manufactories in other parts of the world just like the petrol powered ones, then that raises additional questions about the new or added negative environmental and social impacts from these new forms of production and commerce.

Lastly we come to the issues of maintenance, salvage and scrapping of the machines. It stands to reason that these will also impose novel considerations and the potential or manifest environmental and social impacts there are, I would wager, essentially completely unaccounted for so far.

I respect Musk's capacity as a marketer. He taps into his own kitsch and schmarm, which we might term his "visionary nature," quite effectively in that regard. I almost believe that he believes a large fraction of his own sales pitches himself.

Beyond that, I consider him to be a fraud, primarily because he has managed to create a market that rests on premises which may be largely false, and which remain largely un-scrutinized. I suspect he is fully aware of this, and internally he is laughing his ass off at how easily a fool and his money are parted. As evidence for this, I point to his recent "flamethrower" thing. He took playing a joke on suckers and twisted it so it was a "laughing together" joke (at least if you are stupid enough to fall for it).

Ah well. For now, the cars run, the have tremendous acceleration, they are luxurious, and they work for their owners "presentation of self." Their environmental and social impacts may in fact be no less than any other automobile, or it may be slightly higher in some respects and lower in others. I don't ask all these questions based on the hunch that Teslas are an environmental timebomb waiting to explode; I am guessing they are pretty much on a par with the petrol burners if the sum-total of all inputs and outputs are considered, so they are not really "so bad." Personally, I wouldn't want to have to plan a long-distance trip around the limited number of charging stations, but I suppose that is getting less and less constraining. Not having to pump fuel would certainly be a plus!

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 Post subject: Re: Hats off to Elon Musk
PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 12:14 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Hats off to Elon Musk
PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 4:45 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Hats off to Elon Musk
PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 3:23 am 
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;)

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 Post subject: Re: Hats off to Elon Musk
PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 7:30 am 
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A special model Tesla, not electric, but a gasoline Tesla. :lol:

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