maddogdrivethru.net

Open all night
It is currently Tue Oct 17, 2017 8:10 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Forum rules


It's the Gulag of Fun



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 16 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: What did Pope Francis say?
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2013 4:25 pm 
Offline
buck private
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 20, 2008 8:01 am
Posts: 14041
Reputation points: 8782
The headlines following the Pope's interview left me with the impression that the Pope was soft on abortion, gay practices, ect:
Quote:

Pope Francis sets out vision for more gay people and women in 'new' church


Pope Francis gives wide-ranging interview to Italian journal and urges Catholics to show 'audacity and courage' in drive for reform

• Highlights from the Pope's interview

Ed Pilkington in New York
The Guardian, Thursday 19 September 2013 19.19 BST
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/s ... lic-church
Is that what the Pope was saying:

_________________
Even so, never go to a gunfight without a gun and, if you intend to win, never go to a religious war without religion. You'll lose.
tomkratman.com


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: What did Pope Francis say?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2013 1:38 am 
Offline
Sergeant
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 15, 2008 6:14 pm
Posts: 2051
Location: Pariahville
Reputation points: 3433
I have to say that the Pope sounds like quite a character if he can keep both the secular press and the clergy enamored with him at the same time. Kudos there!

_________________
"Service guarantees citizenship" :(

Welcome to the Maddrive Dogthru!


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: What did Pope Francis say?
PostPosted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 9:55 pm 
Offline
Sergeant Major
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:50 pm
Posts: 26252
Location: West coast of the east coast
Reputation points: 14884
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/27/opini ... inion&_r=1

Quote:
OP-ED COLUMNIST

Springtime for Liberal Christianity
SEPT. 26, 2015

Ross Douthat

DURING his in-flight interview between Cuba and the United States, Pope Francis bristled a little when asked about people who claim he’s too liberal, left-wing, even Communist. In his comments on economics, immigration and the environment, he insisted, “I’m sure that I haven’t said anything more than what’s written in the social doctrine of the church.”

The pontiff has a point, but so did his questioner. Yes, Catholic social teaching does not fit the normal categories of American politics, and popes always come to our shores bearing critiques of right and left alike. But every pope has different interests, a different set of points to stress — and Pope Francis’ message, whether on-script or off-the-cuff, is particularly distinctive.

He is certainly not a Marxist, and he’s not a “liberal” as American politics understands the terms. But he has been a gift to liberals who are also Christians, to religious believers whose politics lean left.

It’s a gift the religious left sorely needed, because the last few decades have made a marriage of Christian faith and liberal politics seem doomed to eventual divorce. Since the 1970s, the mainline Protestant denominations associated with progressive politics have experienced a steep decline in membership and influence, while American liberalism has become more secular and anti-clerical, culminating in the Obama White House’s battles with Francis’ own church. In the intellectual arena, religiously-inclined liberals have pined for a Reinhold Niebuhr without producing one, and the conservative fear that liberal theology inevitably empties religion of real power has found all-too-frequent vindication.

Pope Francis has not solved any of these problems. But his pontificate has nonetheless given the religious left a new lease on life. He has offered encouragement to Catholic progressives by modestly soft-pedaling the issues dividing his church from today’s liberalism — abortion and same-sex marriage — while elevating other causes and concerns. His personnel decisions have confirmed that encouragement; his rhetoric has reinvigorated left-leaning Catholic punditry and thought. And his media stardom has offered provisional evidence for a proposition dear to liberal-Christian hearts — namely, that a public Christianity free from entanglements with right-wing politics could tug the disaffected back toward faith.

The pope’s address to Congress last week was an illustrative moment. The issues that have bound many American Catholics to the Republican Party were mentioned, but obliquely; the word “abortion” was not used, the threats to marriage were not identified. But on the environment, immigration, and the death penalty, he was much more specific and direct. And of the figures he invoked from American history, three — Martin Luther King, Thomas Merton and Dorothy Day — belonged to the midcentury golden age of Catholic liberalism, an era when progressive politics and Christian faith seemed to make a lovely harmony.

You could interpret that invocation as a challenge to liberal-leaning Christians, an invitation to find such a synthesis again. And believers whose politics are further to the right, this columnist included, should actually want that challenge to be met. A revitalized religious left, a Christianity that doesn’t feel like the province of a single political faction, would be a sign of religious vitality writ large. And I would far rather debate politics with Cornel West or the editors of Commonweal than with a liberalism that thinks it can impose meaning on a cosmos whose sound and fury signifies nothing on its own.

But there are deep reasons why liberal Christianity has struggled lately, which a Francis-inspired revival would need to overcome. One is the tendency for a liberal-leaning faith to simply become a secularized faith, obsessed with political utopias and embarrassed by supernatural hopes, until the very point of churchgoing gradually evaporates. (It’s not a coincidence that the most resilient of left-leaning religious communities, the African-American church, is also the most frankly supernaturalist.)

The other is religious liberalism’s urge to follow secular liberalism in embracing the sexual revolution and all its works — a move that promises renewal but rarely delivers, because it sells out far too much of scripture and tradition along the way.

The first tendency is one that this pope’s example effectively rebukes. However “left” his political impulses may be, they are joined to a prayerful and devotional sensibility, an earthy, Satan-invoking zeal that has nothing arid or secularized about it.

The second tendency, though, is one that Francis has tacitly encouraged, by empowering clerics and theologians who seem to believe that Rome’s future lies in imitating the moribund Episcopal Church’s approach to sex, marriage and divorce.

How far to go with them is the question that awaits the pope in Rome this fall, and that hangs over the springtime for liberal Christianity his pontificate has nurtured.

How it’s answered, and what follows, will determine whether we’re watching something genuinely new and fresh emerge — or whether, after the cheering ends, the same winter that enveloped liberal Protestantism after the 1960s will claim Franciscan Catholicism as well.


_________________
The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public’s money.
- misattributed to Alexis De Tocqueville

No representations made as to the accuracy of info in posted news articles or links


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: What did Pope Francis say?
PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 5:11 pm 
Offline
First Sergeant

Joined: Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:49 pm
Posts: 9057
Reputation points: 13573
Why is the pope worried about climate change? God is going to destroy the earth w/ fire.

I can understand why an atheist might be concerned, but the pope? Does he think God is lying?

_________________
"Stay deplorable my friends"


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: What did Pope Francis say?
PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 7:27 pm 
Offline
Oppressive Tyrant and Enemy of Truth
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 6:06 pm
Posts: 15220
Location: under the porch
Reputation points: 13767
He's never owned a gun, a pick up truck, or a dog. Got no use for him.

_________________
First, we must kill moose and squirrel


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: What did Pope Francis say?
PostPosted: Tue Sep 29, 2015 2:27 pm 
Offline
Sergeant Major

Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2008 3:19 pm
Posts: 23324
Reputation points: 15557
C_S wrote:
Why is the pope worried about climate change? God is going to destroy the earth w/ fire.

I can understand why an atheist might be concerned, but the pope? Does he think God is lying?



:lol: :lol:

_________________
I haven't figured out how to the block thingy works but if anyone alters my posts I will become really, really angry and throw monkey poop out of my cage.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: What did Pope Francis say?
PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2015 5:29 pm 
Offline
First Sergeant

Joined: Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:49 pm
Posts: 9057
Reputation points: 13573
I don't believe things happen by chance. I don't believe we are a genetic blend simply happened. I believe everything was created by God and for His purpose - whatever that is I don't have enough wit to comprehend it.

I don't believe in the pope. He's just some guy who doesn't matter. I think Catholics are wrong. He isn't holy. Compared to God he's a nobody. Confessing sins to him or a priest is time wasted on thin air - nothing.

I think one day all of us will answer for what we've done. God is the prime being. He will judge. My plan is to fall on my face prone and beg Him for mercy. If Salvation isn't a free gift from God Himself, I'm doomed. I've never done anything to deserve it.

_________________
"Stay deplorable my friends"


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: What did Pope Francis say?
PostPosted: Tue Oct 13, 2015 7:02 pm 
Offline
buck private
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 20, 2008 8:01 am
Posts: 14041
Reputation points: 8782
Quote:
Pope Francis Disappoints Chilean Leftists, Calls Them ‘Dumb’
Repeat after me: the pope is not an American politician.
by Michael Walsh
October 10, 2015 - 4:28 am
Continued
http://pjmedia.com/tatler/2015/10/10/po ... them-dumb/


I expect the Pope checked the guy out before appointing him.

_________________
Even so, never go to a gunfight without a gun and, if you intend to win, never go to a religious war without religion. You'll lose.
tomkratman.com


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: What did Pope Francis say?
PostPosted: Sun Oct 18, 2015 2:23 am 
Offline
His Most Gracious Majesty, Commie of the Year
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 28, 2009 12:44 pm
Posts: 7060
Reputation points: 14215
C_S wrote:
I don't believe things happen by chance. I don't believe we are a genetic blend simply happened. I believe everything was created by God and for His purpose - whatever that is I don't have enough wit to comprehend it.

I don't believe in the pope. He's just some guy who doesn't matter. I think Catholics are wrong. He isn't holy. Compared to God he's a nobody. Confessing sins to him or a priest is time wasted on thin air - nothing.

I think one day all of us will answer for what we've done. God is the prime being. He will judge. My plan is to fall on my face prone and beg Him for mercy. If Salvation isn't a free gift from God Himself, I'm doomed. I've never done anything to deserve it.



Good for you for exercising your freedom of opinion and freedom of religion!

Many people desire and praise governments that don't allow either. Which reminds me:
"Happy slaves are the bitterest enemies of freedom."
-Marie von Ebner-Eschenbach

Just ask those happy folks living in totalitarian lands and they know exactly what's wrong with "too much freedom".

_________________
All scientists across the world work for US Democratic Party


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: What did Pope Francis say?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 24, 2015 3:44 pm 
Offline
Sergeant Major
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:50 pm
Posts: 26252
Location: West coast of the east coast
Reputation points: 14884
http://www.breitbart.com/big-government ... untouched/


Quote:
LEFT TASTES SOUR GRAPES AS VATICAN SYNOD LEAVES DOCTRINE UNTOUCHED

by THOMAS D. WILLIAMS, PH.D.
24 Oct 2015

As the Vatican synod on marriage and the family draws to a close with no significant change in Catholic doctrine or practice, liberals are left nursing their wounds over yet another revolution that didn’t happen.

The poster child of progressive bitterness is Jesuit Father Thomas Reese, a long-time proponent of liberal reforms in the Catholic Church, who saw in this synod a chance for the sort of sea change that couldn’t have happened under Popes John Paul II or Benedict XVI. And yet it didn’t happen here, either.

Though the synod was convened to discuss the many issues facing Christian families in the world today, Reese and his cohort had a considerably more narrow focus: Communion for the divorced and remarried and a softening of the Church’s condemnation of homosexual sex.

The “success” of the synod would be the degree to which these two objectives were reached.

As Reese himself wrote on Oct. 20: “The bishops appear oblivious to the fact that, at least in the West, the success of the synod will be judged by whether there is an opening to Communion for divorced and remarried Catholics.”

The irony behind Reese’s hubris in attempting to speak for the entire “West” is unfortunately lost on a man whose gauge of the western mind is limited to whatever the New York Times and the Washington Post are spouting.

What of the innumerable faithful in the West who are grateful for the Church’s teaching on marriage? What of the astonishing letter of more than 130 notable converts to Catholicism, who appealed to Rome not to change its precious teaching on marriage and human sexuality?

In their letter, the converts expressed their hope that the bishops “will be encouraged by the multitude of lay faithful who were, and continue to be, attracted to the Church in large part because of what she proposes about the human being in her teaching about sexual difference, sexuality, marriage, and the family.”

As other Christian communions have little by little caved under the pressures of modern society–abandoning age-old Christian teaching on marriage and sexuality and adapting their standards to a secular morality–the Catholic Church alone has stood firm, they asserted.

But Father Reese and other liberal reformers do not like the Church the way it is. They want to remake it to be like the Anglican Church, a body that modifies its teaching every few years to keep up with the times and mirror the secular world around it. Yet none of these reformers takes the logical step of actually becoming Anglicans, because then they would cease to be relevant.

The liberal desire to make marriage perishable is accompanied by their wish to see homosexuality celebrated as part of God’s plan for humanity.

“In the West,” Reese writes, “there is also some support for modifying the church’s approach to homosexuals.” He opposes tried-and-true Christian language such as “hate the sin, love the sinner,” because gays experience their sexual inclinations as “intrinsic” to their identity. Progress would mean loving both the sinner and his sin.

Alas, this has not happened either. As Reese laments, “some bishops are obsessive in their opposition to homosexuality” and a lay woman invited to speak at the synod made the mistake of speaking of homosexuality as a “lifestyle choice,” anathema in the LGBT world.

The root of the problem, Reese writes, is that the “bishops are currently trapped in the old theology they learned in the seminary. They are afraid of new ideas and are not consulting with theological experts who could show them other options.” Never mind that all these bishops attended seminary after the Second Vatican Council. Never mind that Catholics consider the 2000-year-old teaching of Jesus and the apostles to be “Good News” today just as it was when it was preached for the first time.

The fact is, that the bishops have been bombarded with many “new ideas” and after considering them they have said no.

In the end, the Pope and bishops’ resistance to the sirens of the liberal agenda gives hope to the many Catholics who like being Catholic and who expect their Church to be true to the teaching of Jesus and its own tradition.

Yes, the bar is high and none of us clears it all the time. Yes, the gospel message is demanding and requires sacrifice and self-denial, things our fallen nature rejects. And yes, being Catholic means recognizing our own need for mercy because we have all fallen short of the glory of God. But this acknowledgement of our weakness and need for redemption is not demeaning or belittling, but liberating. Being challenged doesn’t make us smaller, it encourages us to pursue greatness.

“Who is left who can offer the world something other than an echo of its own cynicism?” the Catholic converts wrote in their letter. “Who is left who can lead it toward a real experience of love? Now more than ever the world needs the Church’s prophetic witness!”

The bishops, together with Pope Francis, have said “Amen” to that.

Follow Thomas D. Williams on Twitter @tdwilliamsrome



_________________
The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public’s money.
- misattributed to Alexis De Tocqueville

No representations made as to the accuracy of info in posted news articles or links


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 16 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group