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 Post subject: Re: Two oil tankers struck in suspected attacks in Gulf of O
PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 9:58 am 
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It's true about the shallow depths but the Arabian Sea near Hormuz is deeper.

It is true that israel has some near-secret agreements with KSA but they would still giggle with delight if the Shittites and Sunnys went at it.

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 Post subject: Re: Two oil tankers struck in suspected attacks in Gulf of O
PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 10:02 am 
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jack t ripper wrote:
The KSA has a 15% Shittite minority and had a Shittite resistance campaign in KSA for decades.

You know who could easily stir up some shit, has the technological prowess, proven capability and would benefit the most from a Shittite/Sunny death match?

It's that little 7 mile wide country with the 6 pointed start thingy. They have super quiet German electric subs which are harpoon capable. Imagine you placed yourself along the bearing of an Iranian vessel toward the target and launched a harpoon with an electronic signature to mimic Iranian anti-ship missiles..or a torpedo. Then you slip away and fire up the kosher popcorn


:lol:
Image

chijohnaok wrote:
Besides, it is my impression that Israeli-Saudi relations (while officially on the down low) have been on the upswing:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel%E2 ... _relations


Doesn't mean the Israelis wouldn't like to see KSA taking some big 'ol CHOMPS! at Iran! :D

I mean, after all, those envisioned Iranian nukes are likely going to be designed with the range to be able to reach the Mediterranean so anything that sets back Iran is likely a VERY GOOD thing in the minds of even the most moderate Israeli, let alone the Zionists in charge! :lol:

Who better to sick on the Iranians than your new Sunni buddies in the Gulf!?

In fact, isn't this the whole REASON the Israelis are being friendly with the Saudis? (and likely also the reason the Saudis are being friendly with the Israelis): a shared enemy, i.e., Iran.

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 Post subject: Re: Two oil tankers struck in suspected attacks in Gulf of O
PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 10:26 am 
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It’s my recollection that Israel used to be somewhat chummy with Turkey, that is until Erdogan came into power.

IIRC, the Turks assisted Certain Palestinians and EURO NGO’s that were trying to break the Israel quarantine around the Gaza Strip.

Gaza flotilla raid
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaza_flotilla_raid

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 Post subject: Re: Two oil tankers struck in suspected attacks in Gulf of O
PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 10:29 am 
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When comparing air forces keep in mind that Iran has some fairly modern Russian SAM's and depending on where positioned could have a good reach out over the Gulf. Also I think they have a fair number of Chinese Silkwork ASM's that would have to be accounted for before shipping in the Gulf would be considered safe.

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 Post subject: Re: Two oil tankers struck in suspected attacks in Gulf of O
PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 6:23 am 
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KSA Army OOB. But not there are other ground force contingents, such as the "National Guard" ... which for KSA is a standing force, not a reserve force.

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 Post subject: Re: Two oil tankers struck in suspected attacks in Gulf of O
PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 6:41 am 
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The IR Ground forces on the other hand are much murkier ... The International Studies Reports would be useful in making an assessment, but the 2019 version costs $415 and is not on my current wish list

https://www.iiss.org/events/2019/02/military-balance-2019-middle-east-launch

In reading thru older material, much of that based on prior years IISS reports, the Iranians appear to have shifted to a BDE based structure and probably have around 60 maneuver bridges in their "Army". This does not include the "Republican Guard" (a bunch of white nationalists ?? :D ) or the "Militia".

https://www.strausscenter.org/hormuz/iranian-military.html

Undoubtably, 60 BDEs is more than the 10 shown for the KSA. And while the KSA training and equipment is probably superior ... there are probably still senior leaders in the Iranian forces with actual/significant combat experience. But 60 Bdes is 60 Bdes. Enough to surround and pressure the ooosah Bde in Kuwait and still send strong forces at KSA proper.
So what about logistics? Could IR supply their massive forces in a war of maneuver ? Not known of course.

I'd say the edge on the ground goes to the IR they certainly have the numbers. Can they supply and operate them in the field in such a way as to defeat their enemies? Not known.

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 Post subject: Re: Two oil tankers struck in suspected attacks in Gulf of O
PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 7:03 am 
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Armies of Sand...

The Arabs have a decent amount of conventional warfare experience, esp. between 1949 - mid 70s. They thought they could wage conventional wars and tried it against Israel and against each other. They learned that they were not particulary good at waging conventinal war. Iran did not do too great in the 1980s either. Often the equipment they fielded were decent but this did not do much for their performance in battle.

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 Post subject: Re: Two oil tankers struck in suspected attacks in Gulf of O
PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 10:02 am 
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Timeline of events according to the USN

In addition to Iranian fast attack boats, there was a flagged Iranian Navy frigate trying to obtain control of "rescued" crews. The UN Sec General calls for an "independent investigation" ..just call the blue helmets...sure, pal,

What is an Iranian naval vessel doing in the area before the attacks started? Seems to me the mullahs have some 'splaining to do

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... er-attacks

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 Post subject: Re: Two oil tankers struck in suspected attacks in Gulf of O
PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 11:41 am 
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Full daylight overhead picture of the boat that removed the mine. Same hull shape, same stripes, same forward gun, same crew composition, same life jackets. You can see their khaki uniforms

https://www.breitbart.com/middle-east/2 ... r-attacks/

They are completely busted

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 Post subject: Re: Two oil tankers struck in suspected attacks in Gulf of O
PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 11:45 am 
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Shrug. If Iranians want to blow holes in Norwegian cargo ships, the Norwegians should do something about it. Not properly America's problem to solve.

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