maddogdrivethru.net

Open all night
It is currently Tue Nov 21, 2017 6:54 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 176 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Tensions Rise in Spain As Catalonia Referendum Nears
PostPosted: Tue Oct 17, 2017 3:47 pm 
Offline
Gunnery Sergeant
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 17, 2008 3:16 am
Posts: 5060
Location: The Cockney Paradise
Reputation points: 12465
Protest in Barcelona after after two leaders of the Catalan separatist movement are jailed...

Quote:
Tens of thousands have gathered in Barcelona for a candle-lit protest after two leaders of the Catalan separatist movement were jailed.

Jordi Sánchez and Jordi Cuixart are being held without bail while they are under investigation for sedition.

The men were leading figures in the disputed 1 October independence vote, which Madrid has branded illegal.

Spain's Constitutional Court appeared to back central government's position on Tuesday, ruling the vote void.

It had initially suspended the law used by Catalan authorities to call the referendum.

However, Catalan government spokesman Jordi Turull suggested neither the court decision nor the imprisonment of Mr Sánchez and Mr Cuixxart was going to stop the drive for independence, telling reporters "surrender is not something this government is considering".

The air of defiance carried into Tuesday evening, when separatists carrying candles and chanting "We're all Jordis" gathered in Barcelona's Plaza Constitució protesting Mr Sánchez and Mr Cuixart's imprisonment - a move which many on the pro-independence side see as politically motivated.

Catalan leader Carles Puigdemont has already signed a declaration of independence, but halted its implementation to allow negotiations as he called for talks to take place over the next two months.

The position still stands, Mr Turull said.

But the Spanish government has warned that Catalonia must revoke the declaration or face direct rule from Madrid.

Mr Puigdemont has also angered Madrid by refusing to clarify whether or not he declared independence last week. He has until Thursday to clarify his position

The imprisonment of Mr Sánchez, who heads the Catalan National Assembly (ANC), a pro-independence organisation, and Mr Cuixart, leader of Omnium Cultural, had already sparked one protest on Tuesday.

The smaller march saw thousands blocking the streets, chanting "repression is not the solution".

The men are being investigated over a protest on 20 September in which a crowd blocked Civil Guard officers inside a building in Barcelona, Catalonia's regional capital.

Barcelona Mayor Ada Colau - who does not support the current bid for Catalan independence - said they were being held as "political prisoners".

Mr Puigdemont had also said the jailing of the men, known fondly as "the two Jordis", was like having "political prisoners again", a nod to the days when Catalan culture was systematically suppressed under Francsico Franco.

Spanish Justice Minister Rafael Catala dismissed the allegations, however, saying it was purely a judicial decision.

"These are not political prisoners because yesterday's prison ruling was due to a [suspected] crime," he said.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-41655095


Live feed -


_________________
I could be the catalyst that sparks the revolution
I could be an inmate in a long-term institution
I could dream to wide extremes, I could do or die
I could yawn and be withdrawn and watch the world go by
What a waste...


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tensions Rise in Spain As Catalonia Referendum Nears
PostPosted: Tue Oct 17, 2017 3:53 pm 
Offline
Sergeant Major

Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2008 3:19 pm
Posts: 23660
Reputation points: 16181
"Sedition"...that sounds bad. Public hanging then draw and quarter...or maybe it's the other way around...then parade their heads around Catalonia on a stick

_________________
I haven't figured out how to the block thingy works but if anyone alters my posts I will become really, really angry and throw monkey poop out of my cage.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tensions Rise in Spain As Catalonia Referendum Nears
PostPosted: Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:01 pm 
Offline
Sergeant
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2008 10:09 am
Posts: 1231
Location: On the beach
Reputation points: 4228
691 companies have now moved out of the province.

This is a great tragedy for the people of Catalonia.

_________________
"In this present crisis, Government is not the solution to our problem; Government is the problem." - Ronald Reagan

"Because in America, we don't worship Government; we worship God." - Donald Trump


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tensions Rise in Spain As Catalonia Referendum Nears
PostPosted: Wed Oct 18, 2017 8:58 am 
Offline
First Sergeant

Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:50 pm
Posts: 9203
Location: Eskridge, KS
Reputation points: 10914
Quote:
...
691 companies have now moved out of the province.

This is a great tragedy for the people of Catalonia ...


I wonder if that is what Colorado said when Magpul left ?? :D

==

In the mean time, maybe I need to rethink my tentative support for the cat withdrawal ... the BDIC has come out in favor ... I cannot image being on the same side of a discussion as the BDIC ...

Quote:
Spain summons Venezuela Ambassador after Maduro's Catalonia comments


https://www.reuters.com/article/us-spain-politics-catalonia-venezuela/spain-summons-venezuela-ambassador-after-maduros-catalonia-comments-idUSKBN1CN1SF?il=0

_________________
Go trumpf Go !!!
(will the resident return to being the President?)
(will the rainbow shack return to being the White House?)


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tensions Rise in Spain As Catalonia Referendum Nears
PostPosted: Sat Oct 21, 2017 11:27 am 
Offline
First Sergeant

Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:50 pm
Posts: 9203
Location: Eskridge, KS
Reputation points: 10914
Lava seems to feel strongly that Catalonia does not want to break away ... yet the e-Spainish gubermint says they will take action to prevent Catalonia from breaking away. So in my book, this is strong evidence against Lava's ideas. Why would the e-Spanish gubermint take such action unless they actually believed it was necessary?

Quote:
... The Spanish government will sack Catalonia’s secessionist leadership and force the region into a new election, it decided on Saturday, unprecedented steps it said were needed to prevent the region breaking away. ...


https://www.reuters.com/article/us-spain-politics-catalonia/spain-to-sack-catalan-government-in-bid-to-end-secessionist-crisis-idUSKBN1CQ0AQ

_________________
Go trumpf Go !!!
(will the resident return to being the President?)
(will the rainbow shack return to being the White House?)


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tensions Rise in Spain As Catalonia Referendum Nears
PostPosted: Sat Oct 21, 2017 12:46 pm 
Offline
Sergeant
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2008 10:09 am
Posts: 1231
Location: On the beach
Reputation points: 4228
jwilkerson wrote:
Lava seems to feel strongly that Catalonia does not want to break away ... yet the e-Spainish gubermint says they will take action to prevent Catalonia from breaking away. So in my book, this is strong evidence against Lava's ideas. Why would the e-Spanish gubermint take such action unless they actually believed it was necessary?


Actually what I said was that I think the majority of the folks in Catalonia do not want complete independence.

Following the "referendum" of what 40% of the people where 90% voted for independence, without proper voting controls... a scam at best; in which Puigdemont stated the "people have spoken" and whereby he then declared independence but suspended it at the same time. Rejoy then asked Puigdemont to clarify whether he had or had not declared independence (yes or no). He refrained from doing so in the allotted time and the central government is moving to enact Article 155 of the constitution to take control of Catalonia.

If Puigdemont was so fucking certain that the vast majority of folks there want independence he would have declared independence and given the finger to Rejoy. He didn't.

That is because the majority of the working class (those whose shoulders it would fall on to "fight" for independence) do not want it. It is the communists, the upper class Catalans and the intelligentsia "we know what is best for Catalonia" who are the driving force in this move to secede from Spain.

The last I heard, Puigdemont will probably be arrested for sedition.

I would recommend reading the following articles from El Pais:

https://elpais.com/elpais/2017/10/21/in ... 87115.html

Spanish PM activates Article 155, stripping powers of Catalan government
Mariano Rajoy says that he will call elections in Catalonia “as soon as institutional normality” returns. Regional premier Carles Puigdemont will be removed from his position


Quote:
“The autonomy of Catalonia is not being suspended,” he continued. “The people who have put it in risk are being suspended.


https://elpais.com/elpais/2017/10/19/in ... 62878.html

Catalonia: The gravity of the situation
The pro-independence movement has waged a war against the free press


Quote:
Spain is a country with the rule of law, and with a democratic system as young as it is complex. Of course, it is not a perfect democracy, if such a thing even exists. Spain has some serious problems: high levels of unemployment, corruption within the party that is in government, inequality between its different regions, and high abstention in election processes. Even so, since 2006 it has scored 9/10 in The Economist magazine’s Democracy Index, above the United States, France and Italy. Spain also has high benchmarks of pluralism and civil liberties.


And this:

https://elpais.com/elpais/2017/09/29/in ... 40457.html

Income and origins sway support for independence
The majority in favor of breaking away from Spain are established Catalan families with high incomes


The article gives the demographics of how folks stand on the issue. And whatever you may interpret from it, one thing stands out... the vast majority do not want independence.

Like I have said before, I don't have a dog in this fight but where I sit in the bleachers... the left wing and hard core Catalan nationalists are trying to impose their vision of a future which the majority are not in favor of.

_________________
"In this present crisis, Government is not the solution to our problem; Government is the problem." - Ronald Reagan

"Because in America, we don't worship Government; we worship God." - Donald Trump


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tensions Rise in Spain As Catalonia Referendum Nears
PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 9:46 am 
Offline
Gunnery Sergeant
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 17, 2008 3:16 am
Posts: 5060
Location: The Cockney Paradise
Reputation points: 12465
Catalan parliament declares independence from Spain. Puigdemont crashing this plane with no survivors...

Quote:
The Catalan regional parliament has voted to declare independence from Spain, just as the Spanish government appears set to impose direct rule.

The move was was backed 70-10 in a ballot boycotted by opposition MPs.

Spanish Prime Minister Mariano Rajoy earlier told senators direct rule was needed to return "law, democracy and stability" to Catalonia.

The crisis began when Catalans backed independence in a disputed vote earlier this month.

The Catalan government said that of the 43% who took part in the referendum, 90% were in favour of independence. But Spain's Constitutional Court had ruled the vote illegal.

Spain's Senate is still to vote on whether for the first time to enact Article 155 of the Spanish constitution, which empowers the government to take "all measures necessary to compel" a region in case of a crisis.

It would enable Madrid to fire Catalan leaders, and take control of the region's finances, police and public media.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-41780116

_________________
I could be the catalyst that sparks the revolution
I could be an inmate in a long-term institution
I could dream to wide extremes, I could do or die
I could yawn and be withdrawn and watch the world go by
What a waste...


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tensions Rise in Spain As Catalonia Referendum Nears
PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 10:03 am 
Offline
Hair in the soap
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2008 12:46 am
Posts: 17438
Reputation points: 14050
I'm wondering why, in such an important decision, would only 43% show up to vote on it.

Protesting it? Fear? Don't give a shit?

Why?

_________________
..
.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tensions Rise in Spain As Catalonia Referendum Nears
PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 10:08 am 
Offline
Sergeant Major
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:50 pm
Posts: 26655
Location: West coast of the east coast
Reputation points: 15759
NefariousKoel wrote:
I'm wondering why, in such an important decision, would only 43% show up to vote on it.

Protesting it? Fear? Don't give a shit?

Why?


From what I read the anti-independence voters in Catalonia were boycotting the vote. The Spanish government had already declared it an illegal referendum and by casting a ballot (even a "no" vote) many felt they would be giving it an air of legitimacy.

_________________
The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public’s money.
- misattributed to Alexis De Tocqueville

No representations made as to the accuracy of info in posted news articles or links


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Tensions Rise in Spain As Catalonia Referendum Nears
PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 1:04 pm 
Offline
Gunnery Sergeant
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 17, 2008 3:16 am
Posts: 5060
Location: The Cockney Paradise
Reputation points: 12465
The Uk says it won't recognise Catalan independence...

Quote:
The UK will not recognise the Catalan parliament's decision to declare independence from Spain, Downing Street says.

Theresa May's official spokesman said the declaration was based on a vote that had been declared illegal.

He added that the UK wanted to see the unity of Spain preserved.

The Catalan regional parliament has voted to declare independence from Spain, while the Spanish parliament has approved direct rule over the region.

The UK prime minister's spokesman said in a statement: "The UK does not and will not recognise the unilateral declaration of independence made by the Catalan regional parliament."

"It is based on a vote that was declared illegal by the Spanish courts. We continue to want to see the rule of law upheld, the Spanish constitution respected, and Spanish unity preserved."

Catalan MPs backed the independence motion 70-10 in a ballot boycotted by the opposition.

Spanish Prime Minister Mariano Rajoy had told senators direct rule was needed to return "law, democracy and stability" to Catalonia.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-41783238

_________________
I could be the catalyst that sparks the revolution
I could be an inmate in a long-term institution
I could dream to wide extremes, I could do or die
I could yawn and be withdrawn and watch the world go by
What a waste...


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 176 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 14 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group