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 Post subject: Re: What is trumpf up to ?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 9:42 pm 
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That 5% is a deliberate understatement. It does not include the US training costs, dev costs, and build costs for the men and eq stationed in NATO Europe. It only includes the costs incurred while in Europe.

The more accurate figure is about 25% of the US dod budet is spent defending the EU.

Fuck Europe. Bring Americans home.

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 Post subject: Re: What is trumpf up to ?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 10:29 pm 
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mdiehl wrote:
That 5% is a deliberate understatement. It does not include the US training costs, dev costs, and build costs for the men and eq stationed in NATO Europe. It only includes the costs incurred while in Europe.

The more accurate figure is about 25% of the US dod budet is spent defending the EU.

Fuck Europe. Bring Americans home.



Not to mention the probable reduction in force structure if they were not required in Europe....AND the burden on the families.

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 Post subject: Re: What is trumpf up to ?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 11:02 pm 
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wulfir wrote:
Maybe Trump is not all that unpredictable anymore:

Quote:
Where Trump’s intent has grown abundantly clear is the manner in which he is speaking to his supporters. At his rally in North Dakota two weeks ago, he said, “Sometimes our worst enemies are our so-called friends or allies, right?” At a subsequent rally in Montana last week, the president declared, “Our allies in many cases were worse than our enemies.” Trump understands the power of repetition, and it is notable to see this allies, they’re the worst, amirite formulation becoming a staple of his rhetoric. . . . Compared to a week ago, it is now harder to imagine Trump will use the summit to leverage concessions that will make him appear like a strong negotiator, and much easier to imagine that he will use it to instigate a diplomatic crisis with NATO. By the time this is over, he may well have reoriented American foreign policy completely. It may seem bizarre that one man could do this, especially given that almost nobody in Trump’s administration or the ranks of the party’s political professionals share his goal of jettisoning NATO or closely courting Russia. Yet Trump has shown the ability to lead his base wherever he wants to take it. And where the base has gone, the party has eventually followed. . . . In the last few months, the Trump administration has taken repeated concrete steps to damage European and international institutions and specific European governments. . . . The idea that there can be a positive or neutral summit that strengthens the alliance, or somehow signals to Moscow that NATO is united, is ridiculous. It marks the kind of diplomatic thinking that Trump satirizes. What will be clear after the summit was already clear, if one wanted to see it, before: There is not a unified group of powerful countries ready to counter Russian geopolitical pressures on Europe and the Middle East. Countries on the Russian periphery cannot count on NATO support to chart future directions away from Moscow. North Africa and the Eastern Mediterranean won’t be getting infusions of stability from NATO, which also cannot offer a counterweight to Turkish president Recep Erdogan’s nationalist rhetoric.

Donald Trump didn’t do all of this alone — the rise of Moscow-sympathizing nationalist governments in Central Europe, and the U.K.’s self-inflicted Brexit wound also sapped NATO’s ability to offer what it claims to stand for. (The United Kingdom lost its foreign minister two days before Trump’s arrival, and its prime minister may face a vote of no confidence as he departs.) So did decades of European governments agreeing in word, but not in deed, with Washington’s calls for stronger shared defenses.

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2018/07/trump-and-nato-even-the-best-case-scenario-is-grim.html


So, based on this rhetoric, we are supposed to believe that (a) Russia is a big boogeyman, who threatens to apply "geopolitical pressure" on the countries on its periphery; and that (b) Trump is complicit with this, and that his antagonism towards NATO is a reflection of that "collusion" :)

Okay so, Russia: ~2011 or 2012, invaded that little country on the border with Armenia, forget the fricking name . . . What did Europe do? Oh that's right, Europe did NOTHING. No build up, no actual effort to defend themselves, in fact we see now that Europe has let itself fall further into dependence on the U.S. to defend it! We could extend this back to the previous decade too!

Second Chechen War: 1999 to 2009: what did Europe do? Jack and shit?

2014 Russian meddling in Euromaidan then annexation of Crimea and instigation of a pro-Russian separatist movement in eastern Ukraine. What did Europe do? Pretty much jack and shit.

The facts speak pretty clearly: either Europe doesn't actually worry very much about Russia, or Europe is dependent on Yankee protection! :P

If you guys were gracious, and were like: "please protect us, we are nations of pussies who do not want to fight. But here . . . you can have your pick of our finest women and cheap wine and cheese and leather coats and shit . . . "that would be different. But we all know that is not the prevailing attitude out of Europe--at least not from the intelligentsia, the ruling aristocracies, and the media. Obviously not every European, and probably not even a true "majority" are thankless cunts who expect the United States to serve them by providing protection while getting nothing in return but grief and high tariffs. But the theme of international relations with many of the most influential nations in the Euro zone certainly tend toward that flavor.

I'm with Midol on this one: fuck Yourup!

If Russia is coming to get you, then you best start getting ready for it, cause very likely we ain't gonna be there to save your ass for too much longer! or at least that is what a sizeable number of us Yanks hope for.

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 Post subject: Re: What is trumpf up to ?
PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 7:45 am 
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Like I have been written before this YouTuber, IMO, understands the current global shifts, especially in regard to China and Germany which he addresses very nicely in this video:


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 Post subject: Re: What is trumpf up to ?
PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 8:27 am 
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Shit. Never heard of Nord Stream II. The damn thing is bypassing NATO allies and clearly weakens any pressure Ukraine had on gas deliveries to Western Europe. Not to mention it is an obvious cash cow for Russia. Meanwhile Poland and the Baltics are screwed. NATO, my ass. It's completely cynical.

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 Post subject: Re: What is trumpf up to ?
PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 10:40 am 
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Makes you wonder if the Russians built this to PURPOSELY undermine the NATO alliance

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 Post subject: Re: What is trumpf up to ?
PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 10:41 am 
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Oh, dayum! :o

Lotsa "Russian energy" scolding going on in the NATO meeting. ;)


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 Post subject: Re: What is trumpf up to ?
PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 12:14 pm 
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jack t ripper wrote:
Shit. Never heard of Nord Stream II. The damn thing is bypassing NATO allies and clearly weakens any pressure Ukraine had on gas deliveries to Western Europe. Not to mention it is an obvious cash cow for Russia. Meanwhile Poland and the Baltics are screwed. NATO, my ass. It's completely cynical.

Image


Image
By Kremlin.ru, CC BY 4.0, https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.p ... d=17281739
:twisted:

For perspective, that´s not just Germans and Russians smirking but also
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fran%C3%A7ois_Fillon
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Rutte
who also preferred options.

The guy not smiling is a Russian, of course;
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexey_Miller

Image
It´s his style ;)

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Last edited by Scharfschütze on Wed Jul 11, 2018 12:43 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: What is trumpf up to ?
PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 12:26 pm 
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NefariousKoel wrote:
Oh, dayum! :o

Lotsa "Russian energy" scolding going on in the NATO meeting. ;)



Trumps just jealous cause Merkel is circumventing HIS Russian Collusion with HER Russian Collusion :lol:

Its all so farcical! Trump just doesn't give a fuck! He's 72 years old, a billionaire, former "movie star," and he is just flying right into all the forbidden diplomatic airspaces, just like "Fuck, I don't care."

Meanwhile, the ruling classes of Western Europe are shitting their literal pants cause this coarse, potty-mouthed, yellow-haired gorilla from Queens is threatening to expose their under the table dealings which fatten THEIR accounts while keeping their people shackled with high taxation, brainwashing propaganda and a ruling mechanism that cannot be voted for or against :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: What is trumpf up to ?
PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:05 pm 
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Hmmm...where did that airliner come from that the Russians shot down over Ukraine? I'm a little fuzzy on that.

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