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 Post subject: Re: Trump, Trump, Trump
PostPosted: Tue Aug 07, 2018 12:12 pm 
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mdiehl wrote:
I disagree on FDR. The plain fact is that there was nothing the USA could do for Eastern Europe, and frankly the states bordering Russia are quite clearly of more vital concern to Russia than to the USA.


Churchill disagreed...but in any event, FDR was an old guy in a blanket and the US was not going to fight a new war with the Soviet Union, you are right...the key point is the Russians have been behaving badly for a century.

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 Post subject: Re: Trump, Trump, Trump
PostPosted: Tue Aug 07, 2018 12:23 pm 
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Churchill wasn't the guy whose nation would have to go to war with the Russians to "save" Poland, etc. The US would basically have had to do that job entirely on its own, with France in particular undermining the effort from the outset as they were already doing by Autumn 1944.

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 Post subject: Re: Trump, Trump, Trump
PostPosted: Tue Aug 07, 2018 12:24 pm 
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Anthropoid wrote:
Putin has never been "up to" any good. Who cares.


Some people think Putin is a hero. :D

A saviour that rules with a firm hand. Finally a man in charge that works for RUSSIA - not lining the pockets of already filthy rich people. Restoring the nation to its rightful position as a great power.


I'm not saying they are correct, but they exist. :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: Trump, Trump, Trump
PostPosted: Tue Aug 07, 2018 12:30 pm 
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Presumedly they're Russians?
Why do they believe that?

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 Post subject: Re: Trump, Trump, Trump
PostPosted: Tue Aug 07, 2018 12:36 pm 
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FDR..the poor guy was half dead already. Congress would never have approved another declaration of war.

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 Post subject: Re: Trump, Trump, Trump
PostPosted: Tue Aug 07, 2018 1:01 pm 
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jack t ripper wrote:
FDR..the poor guy was half dead already. Congress would never have approved another declaration of war.



I would agree.....and labeling it as an "Overseas Contingency Operation" would not have worked back then. :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Trump, Trump, Trump
PostPosted: Tue Aug 07, 2018 1:25 pm 
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Especially not in light of the fact that popular press and national sentiment was that the Russians were very definitely America's strong ally. To suddenly have been at war with Russia would have been an impossible policy to "sell" to the overwhelming majority of Americans in 1945.

It took decades of intentionally pissing in the well for the shadow government to indoctrinate enough Americans into believing that "Russians are the devil incarnate" to create the knee-jerk bullshit international policies that the federal gov't now embraces regardless of political party.

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 Post subject: Re: Trump, Trump, Trump
PostPosted: Tue Aug 07, 2018 1:47 pm 
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Too bad..opportunity lost. All we needed was 4 months of drawn out negotiations with the Russians...then a border provocation of some sort and then..SURPRISE...say hello to Mr Plutonium. :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Trump, Trump, Trump
PostPosted: Tue Aug 07, 2018 1:59 pm 
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Sure but in the end why would we want to?

I mean, IMO of course, eastern Europe (all of continental Europe really) isn't worth any price in American blood or treasure. If Russia wants to march on Berlin again, I can't see a reason to care enough to intervene.

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 Post subject: Re: Trump, Trump, Trump
PostPosted: Tue Aug 07, 2018 3:14 pm 
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mdiehl wrote:
Presumedly they're Russians?
Why do they believe that?


Some are Russian, some are not.

In Russia the state media dominates and pushes a pro-Putin outlook down the throats of the people. If you voice a Putin critical viewpoint the state will go Stalin on you. Some like him because he "said fuck you to America" and spends great sums on the military. Russia strong! The compare him with the disorder following the end of the Soviet Union and freedom of press and shit like that compared to order and strength...

Some are Swedish - some are on the left. Old 1968ers, commies that see Putin as an extension of the USSR carrying on the struggle against the Imperial USA.

...others are on the far right and see a national conservative leader which they would themselves like to have. Putin stomps down on feminism, LGBT and crap media etc. Builds up the armed forces and hold kick ass parades. Führe uns und wir folgen, der neue Morgen wartet schon... On the internet they write 'no more brothers war' meaning good, decent, white nations like Germans and Russians should not be tricked by the Jews to wage war on each other again...


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