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 Post subject: Re: Will Europe Ever Defend Itself?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2018 11:00 am 
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EUBanana wrote:
Their vid on l@z0rz is even better...

https://www.lockheedmartin.com/us/what- ... nergy.html


My brother works for Boeing defense division. They have multi-tiered marketing strategies. That's the one for the Congressmen and visiting officials from Poland and Finland. :lol:

When they are up against "quants" (physics, math PhD's) from DOD they bring along their own Asperger syndrome advisors. Often my brother has to send the back to their rooms to get different ties. God help them if the DOD has good looking women with them.

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 Post subject: Re: Will Europe Ever Defend Itself?
PostPosted: Mon May 21, 2018 1:41 pm 
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Germany's military is even worse than I previously thought.

They are so short of functional helicopters that German military helicopter pilots are forced to train on yellow helicopters belonging to the German version of AAA (American Automobile Association).

Image

:(

You can read about that and more at the following link:

http://www.latimes.com/world/europe/la- ... story.html

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 Post subject: Re: Will Europe Ever Defend Itself?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2018 3:01 pm 
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http://www.breitbart.com/london/2018/06 ... to-allies/

Quote:
Exclusive: Ambassador Grenell Gives Stark Warning Over ‘Woeful’ Readiness of NATO Allies


3 Jun 2018

BERLIN, Germany: Tackling NATO nations failing to meet their alliance obligations is a key priority for President Trump, his right-hand-man in Europe has revealed in major and unprecedented remarks on the credibility of the military of the European Union’s largest economy.
Speaking to Breitbart London during a sit-down interview at the U.S. residence in Berlin, recently confirmed Ambassador Richard Grenell delivered a frankly worded condemnation of Germany’s contribution to the NATO alliance to which the United States is a significant contributor.

“NATO spending is one thing that the President told me directly that he wants me to accomplish. It is a very difficult issue, and is why I’m thinking very creatively about how we do it”, said Grenell, who remarked this was an area where other diplomats had failed to make progress.

Almost all NATO nations have consistently failed to meet their commitments to the alliance, which requires all members enjoying the reciprocity of mutual defence to spend two per cent of their own GDP on the military. Of the major economies within NATO, only the United States, the United Kingdom, and Poland meet their obligation, and even the UK has been accused of using an accounting trick to hit the defence spending level.

Ambassador Grenell told Breitbart London: “It is woeful; Germany is the largest economy in Europe. They made a commitment to NATO, and they should be serious about that commitment; it is a multilateral institution that guarantees the allies, guaranteeing freedom.

“Germany made that commitment, and we expect the Germans to follow through… We have yet to see a serious plan put forward as to how they get to that two per cent of GDP. The two per cent is also just the base number, it is not the end — a country like Germany should be able to ensure they are ready to fight if need be… I have to say, as serious as the German diplomats are, they know you must have a credible threat of military action behind you if you’re going to be successful in diplomacy.


“That’s one thing that’s missing from the German diplomatic conversation — they right now don’t have behind them a credible threat of military action.”

All NATO members, Germany included, reaffirmed their commitment to the alliance during the 2014 Cardiff summit which saw the nations sign a declaration that they would work to increase their military spending to the two per cent baseline level. Despite the promises, there has been scant improvement since.

Although the U.S. Ambassador to Germany did not mention Chancellor Angela Merkel by name, his deep concern for the state of the German armed forces reached under her nearly 13 years at the head of government was clearly apparent. Ambassador Grenell said there was an element of denial in Germany’s public discourse over the state of their own armed forces, and that certain political elements within Germany were actively working against the nation being in a good state of defence.

The Ambassador remarked: “German military officials know that the readiness issue is a serious problem, there are no working submarines, for example; they don’t have a military that is currently ready.

Continuing, he said: “They are joining the Security Council in January, joining France and Great Britain… There is a seriousness to that. If you’re going to be a leader on the Security Council, you have to have a basic level of preparation when it comes to military readiness.

“We’re ready for that conversation to take hold outside of German politics, I think the public is eager for it. We see it happening. The German public is interested in these issues, and many are surprised when they find out the facts of just how the military is not as ready as people think they are.”

This gap between the reality of the German armed forces and the understanding many have of the situation may be caused by a refusal by many in the political elite to accept the problem in public. Ambassador Grenell told Breitbart London: “I have brought the military readiness and the lack of a plan up with the German politicians I have met with.

“This is a very important point, and many are very supportive. But there’s a difference between the private support we get, and the public actions towards that plan, and that’s what we want to see.”

In a major throwdown, Ambassador Grenell suggested one way NATO member Germany could be forced to confront its own problems would be for her allies to shame the nation. A problem with the multilateral approach so far, he said, was that the United States had been too willing to accommodate nations that simply lacked the ability to engage in military action by not asking them to participate in the first place.

Grenell said: “We made a mistake in not publicly asking the Germans to participate in the Syria operation.

“We cannot go into operations and say to ourselves ‘Well, the Germans aren’t able to participate, they don’t even have the proper equipment, so lets not even ask them to participate’… I think that’s a mistake… whenever we have allied operations, we must go through a formal process of asking the Germans to participate, and letting them go through their process with their public and political leaders to come to a thoughtful answer of saying ‘No we can’t, we don’t have the equipment. We can’t fly with you; we can’t do ocean exercises with you, etc’.

“We have to be able to highlight, so the public and political class can understand the seriousness to which the readiness issue is a problem. They made the commitment to NATO.”

The Ambassador’s remarks, and the revelation of the high expectations he was personally conveying from President Trump for Germany’s future defence comes amid a series of scandals and revelations surrounding the German military. Attention was focussed on the outgoing Luftwaffe (air force) chief on Tuesday after a flight of four jet fighters buzzed Berlin in his honour, prompting a flurry of newspaper headlines.

Yet as reported by Tagesschau in March when the forced retirement of Lieutenant General Karl Müllner was announced, the officer was widely seen as the greatest critic of the government within the armed forces and often challenged the ministry of defence on procurement issues. His “not quite voluntary” removal was reported as having “rid [German defence minister] Von Der Leyen of her most prominent military critic”

In a further embarrassment for the German armed forces, Berlin local paper the Morgenpost noted the four Eurofighter jets taking part in the fly-by in the retiring officer’s honour represented the whole combat-ready force of the aircraft in German service. Although the country theoretically has 128 of the planes, only ten are able to fly, and just four of those are able to be armed, owing to a shortage of weapons equipment.



Quote:
The shortage of aircraft means that Germany is unable to fulfill its NATO obligations to have 82 combat ready jets for crisis situations.

The wing pod issue is only one problem facing the Luftwaffe. Der Spiegel reported that there are only enough missiles to make only four Eurofigher jets ready for combat.


and

Quote:
Accounting tricks

In a Bundeswehr document provided to the German parliament last year, the military classified 39 of 128 jets as combat ready.

A Bundeswehr spokesperson told Der Spiegel that the "daily actual availability" of the Eurofighter right now is better than last year.

However, Der Spiegel said that the military appeared to count any Eurofighter that can fly as ready, even if they are only available for training or for maneuvers without missiles or defense systems.

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/articl ... iegel.html

No working submaries.
Only 4 Eurofighter jets out of a total fleet of 128 are combat ready
Counting fighters that have no missiles/weapons as "combat ready" :roll:

And the German Defense Minister's solution is to forcibly retire her biggest critic.

Four years ago Germany committed to increasing its military spending to the 2% NATO mark, yet here we are and they are still failing to do so.

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 Post subject: Re: Will Europe Ever Defend Itself?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2018 3:39 pm 
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Quote:
... Four years ago Germany committed to increasing its military spending to the 2% NATO mark, yet here we are and they are still failing to do so ..


Priorities ... like funding the greek bail out and the moozlim invasion ...

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 Post subject: Re: Will Europe Ever Defend Itself?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2018 4:03 pm 
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Well, the good news is was quite an honor to have the entire Luftwaffe do a flyover of the involuntary retirement ceremony.

No workable submarines? Those are supposed to be the best diesel-electric boats in the world but you have to replace the batteries and change the oil every once in a while.

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 Post subject: Re: Will Europe Ever Defend Itself?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2018 6:35 am 
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jack t ripper wrote:
Well, the good news is was quite an honor to have the entire Luftwaffe do a flyover of the involuntary retirement ceremony.

No workable submarines? Those are supposed to be the best diesel-electric boats in the world but you have to replace the batteries and change the oil every once in a while.


Meanwhile Merkel is proposing that Europe have a single border (for real this time) and a system for redistributing Muslims across Europe without any of the countries (this time) being able to say a thing about it.

As for the "SURE Mr. Trump, we'll get our military up and running ;) " - you should look at actions, not words. Germany is only interested in controlling Europe and forcing it to buy German and to take in Muslims. That's their Grand Vision for Europe in a nutshell, everyone takes debt to buy German, if you can't afford it then others will bail you out and you buy more German. Meanwhile they'll take control of your economy and fuck you over even worse.

As for the couple of east European countries that are cautious due to their experience of having already endured similar bullshit from Moscow - they are to be punished and vilified in media. But that itself proposes a problem; first it shows that not everyone is behind the vision unilaterally which is intolerable even as a thought and secondly, it comes with the risk of further antagonizing the people and possibly driving people out from EU.

So they are at an impasse. How to control the member states and make them accept more Islam without making them leave EU? It almost seems like they had a choice to make - either try to make EU stronger or to pursue the vision of Islamic Europe regardless of cost or consequences.

As with women, you eventually come at a crossroads where you have to choose one or lose both. Double tapping only works for a short while and every such arrangement runs it's course.

Now we are waiting to see what the EU heads (Merkel) will make of it.

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 Post subject: Re: Will Europe Ever Defend Itself?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2018 2:02 pm 
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It looks like we've gone from Will Europe Ever Defend Itself? to Can Europe Ever Defend Itself? to Does Europe Even Want to Defend Itself? It's suicidal. Not that we're so much better here. The tipping point is coming for the US as well. The savages will prevail unless mindsets change.

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 Post subject: Re: Will Europe Ever Defend Itself?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2018 2:53 pm 
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CatLover7 wrote:
It looks like we've gone from Will Europe Ever Defend Itself? to Can Europe Ever Defend Itself? to Does Europe Even Want to Defend Itself? It's suicidal. Not that we're so much better here. The tipping point is coming for the US as well. The savages will prevail unless mindsets change.


Finland is still standing strong. So are countries like Poland and Hungary etc.

Greetings from my old unit.

Panzerjägers don't defend, they only attack!

(just some combined arms attack training as usual)

We also had a nice big parade for the Flag Day of the FDF. Shit ton of people showed up to view the parade that consisted of all the armed branches of FDF, 1,200 troops, dozens of vehicles and an airshow.

We were just looking at the Hornet going full afterburners in steep climb above us as I heard this old 60+ lady start talking of Stuka dive horns and stuff and how loud the Hornet was. She kept going about bases etc., and other stuff, the recent modernizations and changes.

When you can casually overhear old ladies discuss military matters with a level of understanding exceeding that of many men in more "progressive" countries and the sheer support and pride in all of us present there as if it was some big rock festival.. The sheer excitement on kids' faces when they climbed into various IFVs, on top of Leopard II, took pics in front of the LRMS and wanted to try to shoulder the demonstration Stinger..

Man, I just felt that ours is a country and culture that still has some life in it.

There were speeches, flowers were lowered to the graves of war veterans and so, respect was paid to attending vets. The evening ended with military's music show with a leading singer performing there. President himself issued an Order of the Day praising the FDF for their motivation and capabilities.

Even YLE news noted that southern Ostrobothnia is "famous for it's national defense minded populace". That was well at display yesterday.


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 Post subject: Re: Will Europe Ever Defend Itself?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2018 4:54 pm 
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:lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Will Europe Ever Defend Itself?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2018 7:32 pm 
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Quote:
... all the armed branches of FDF, 1,200 troops, dozens of vehicles and an airshow ...


Oh my ... the Finnish Infantry Corps has 1,200 troops? And the Tank Army has dozens of vehicles !!??

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