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 Post subject: Re: Shooting and Firearms
PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2018 12:14 am 
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Got an AR and .40 days ago. Both Smith & Wesson M&P 2s.

Now to resist the temptation to go on an accessorizing bingefest like that of an upper class wife buying shoes and handbags. :x

Grabbed the extras I didn't already have, and a thousand rounds for each, to start. Still need to mount some iron sights on the rail (minimum), clean 'em up and get some Battle Born grease in 'em before going to the ranch.

Have been busy doing all kinds of shit after the move so still haven't got around to it. Soon™!


Already thinking of getting another upper chambered in something else. 6.5G? It's the ammo cost I'm most worried about so not in a big hurry to get more costly shit just yet.

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 Post subject: Re: Shooting and Firearms
PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2018 7:57 am 
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Quote:
... before going to the ranch ...


Which ranch ?? Our's is called "North Branch Ranch" :)

==

Quote:
... another upper chambered in something else. 6.5G? ...


I got a 6.5G(18) upper Dec 2015 and love the external ballistics ... it is basically a "308 on a small frame" .. meaning it has the distance and even less wind drift (longer thinner bullet) than .308WIN ... but can be mounted on a 5.56 lower (small frame) not requiring a 7.62 (AR-10 large frame) lower.

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My downside also rests with the ammo, but more the availability of factory ammo than the cost.

There are very few choices ... complete lack of breadth and depth in the ammo supply. This is realistically a reloader cartridge (as are all of the 6 and 6.5 cartridges).

I've mostly used Hornady 123 AMAX, though that was discontinued about a year ago in favor of the Hornady 123 ELD-M. And I've shot a lot of that also and it is fine.

But I tested the Federal Gold Metal load with 130gr Berger bullet and it is better (higher ballistic coefficient) so I want to shoot that. I've only been able to get one case of 200rds. So, I have deactivated this upper until I can get more ammo for it.

As to prices, the 123 ELD-M will run between about $1.00 and $1.20 ... with the average hopefully below $1.10 per round.

The Hornady 123SST is the hunting round. It is preferred for hogs, but not needed for other critters. If you want to deer hunt, I recommend aiming for the center of the neck and using the ELD-M round. It has more fragmentation than the SST round which has more penetration. SST for hogs ELD-M for deer with a neck shot.

==
Oh and I recommend an adjustable gas block on the upper ... I speak from experience :)

==
But very capable upper ... the most flexible I know of for a 5.56 lower ... can easily do 50yds to 900yds ... only down side is I cannot get the ammo ...

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 Post subject: Re: Shooting and Firearms
PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2018 8:09 am 
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That last one is undeniably cool looking. This does seem like an expensive hobby. :lol:

Do you realize what kind of high-end fly poles and reels you could buy for the cost of this shit? Hell, I think you could fund a cabin in Montana right on the Madison. ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Shooting and Firearms
PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2018 8:58 am 
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Quote:
... hat last one is undeniably cool looking ..
Oh, all of those are the same gun, just different crap hanging off of it on a given day.

From top to bottom

01 - Nightforce 7-35x T3 scope, Spuhr mount

02 - Leupold Mk6 3-18x T3 scope, Badger rings
Wilcox RAPTAR Laser Range Finder
BAE UTC-x thermal clipon

03 - Burris xtr2 3-15x scr-mil scope, Leupold rings

All three, Silencer Co OMEGA 7.62 suppressor
Top 2, Harris 6-9 bipod

Also, Manfrotto tripod and interface
Rails on rails
Elander (Israelli) metal 17rd magazines (I put up to 15rds in them)
Magpul furniture
vtac v2 sling

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 Post subject: Re: Shooting and Firearms
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2018 3:25 pm 
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2018-08-12
1000-1200
70F
05 MPH SSW

Goals: Light load walk with some wind practice

Environment: Not too hot, barely a breeze, partly cloudy.

Equipment:
5.56(18), L&SMk6 3-18x, 2xMags 5rds each 77gr IMI
Manfrotto M190 + 322rc2 head, plus carry bag
M1911 .45ACP with two 8 rd mags with 7rds each, SERPA holster and pistol belt
Bushy arc elite 1600 LRF and Kestrel 2500NV on belt
Rite Rain note pad and pen
Pace beads
Phone with Shooter (also used as phone cam)
Pack with 3.2L water bladder, first aid kit.
Comtac3 headset
Total weight just over 26 Lbs

Activity:
Walked out to the 500yd firing point (FP), just shy of 900yds. Setup tripod for standing position, waited a few minutes for cows to clear the line of fire (they came over to me hoping for treats, I had none today).

Image

Wind estimate was 3 MPH 150 degrees off the bullet path. Held 2.2 mils up and 3 MPH right. First hit was right edge of target. Shots 2-5 held center of wind and 2.2 mils up. I could see all the hit splotches on the target.

Packed up and headed to 730yd FP ... setup there with tripod for seated position. Wind estimate the same, 3 mph 150 degrees off bullet path.

Image

First round right 2 inches ... held center for the other shots ... I could see shots 2 and 3 splotches (right side of center, top above center) but not 4 and 5, though I could hear them ping when they hit.
Packed up and moved to the 500yd target and took target pic.

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Continued on across creek to the 730yd target and took target pic.

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On the way pack I decided to return in the creek. There were pools of water here and there in the creek, but the creek is not "running" ... we have had well below our normal amount of rain since May.

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There are several "isthumus' " in this part of the creek. I saw that "island" and remembered sitting down on that island about 4 years ago, the first time I went in the woods with new PVS-14 and Apollo. So, I went up on the left bank, thinking I would find the trail (deer/coyote trail now expanded by cows) which leads up thru a collapsed bank about 60 feet up and out into the higher South pasture. Instead the bank started getting muddy, I kept going. THen I sank in the mud about 3/4 of the way up to my knees.
I pulled my feet out, but my muck boots remained down in the mud. I had walked into a seepage area on the bank. Due to amount of exertion I had been putting forth, I had to rest and recover wind, before continuing to extricate myself. So I laid in the mud for about 3 minutes until breathing returned to normal. Then I was able to dig my hands down in the mud and pull out each boot and put them back on. Then I used the tripod and gun to steady myself so I could stand up. Then backtracked until I got to a piece of bank I thought I could go down. I turned and faced towards the bank, away from the creek and laid down and slid down the bank into the water, which was up to my knees. The muck boots flooded, I let them.
I then walked through that large pool, being feed by that seepage and slowing stepped up out of the pool onto a flatrock bottom of the creek. Oops, slipped and went down. I did a reverse spread-eagle (I actually practice falling :) ) and landed on my back, which means I landed on my pack, which was great, no damage what so ever, except to my "pride" :D ... I laid there and recovered some more ... then used manfrotto and gun to stand up ... and with 4-legs ... moved slowly to a gravel sand bank off the slick flat rock.
(by the way ... all these things have happened to me before in other creek walks in other parts of the creek :) ) ...
Then finally I rounded the next isthumus and realized the whole problem was caused by my mis-judging which Isthumis I was at. There is so much vegetation I couldn't tell them apart. Much easier in the winter :)
So then I again crossed to the South bank, saw the deer/coyote/deer trail in question and proceeded up the 60 foot bank on that trail, out into the South pasture and then home.

Summary/Results:
Total elapsed time 1 hr 57 min 23 seconds.
Total pace bead count 9x3 + 7 = 3,400yds = 1.93 miles.
Average Speed: Call it 1 mile per hour. That's typical for walks where I stop to mess with the gear and also where I spend time down in the creek. I was probably moving 2.5 maybe 3 in some spots ... I was trying to "step out" when I could ... but the shooting stops and creek really take down the average.

There were spiders every 6 inches in every direction in the woods by the creek ... but didn't see any brown recluses ...


I felt "exhilarated" after my return ... missing the queues on which isthumus I was at was fabulous. I consider the most important aspect of training to "take yourself out of your comfort zone" ... and the muddy seepaage ... and sliding down the bank into the pool and slipping on the flat rock ... all did a good job of taking me out of my comfort zone. But if you practice taking yourself out of your comfort zone 100s ney 1000s of times ... it gets easier and easier. Your brain does not panic ... your brain just tells your body what to do next to accomplish the mission. I felt some "surprise" ... at the seepage being there (it wasn't supposed to be ! :) ) ... but otherwise, my brain was calm.

Good exercise today !!

The main "black mark" was, I did not bring cleaning rod and patches and some mud did get in the front end of the suppressor. When I got back it took 10s to clear it. Need to bring rudimentary cleaning kit in the back. This exact thing happened to me before ... about 5 years ago ... with the old Sig762(16). Fell in the creek, got crap in the barrel and had no cleaning kit to get it out with me. Need to bring the cleaning kit when you go to the field !

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 Post subject: Re: Shooting and Firearms
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2018 6:38 pm 
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Hey Wilks.. does that angled reflex sight take awhile to get used to?

Been thinking of getting a reflex or red dot for the AR. As I said, I don't plan on putting a scope on it anytime soon - I have bolt & lever action rifles with scopes if I wanna do long distance shooting. But if I did later on, I'd probably futz with an angled reflex as backup if I could get used to using it.

Did some zero'ing today with the CAR and the .40. Didn't shoot nearly as much as I wanted because it was hot & humid as the devil's asshole out there (plus my uncle wanted to jaw with me in the middle). Left early because we could tell rain was coming; made it out just in time before a downpour. :|

Plenty ammo remaining to get acquainted with them. Conservation Dept of MO has unsupervised ranges with benches, target holders & such. Will probably go down to one about 18 miles south of me and hit the 50 and 100 yd lanes sometime soon. Hopefully it's not too populated during the weekday. Plus get more pistol time in, as I need much more practice at that than the rifle which was keepin' it pretty tight. :geek:

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 Post subject: Re: Shooting and Firearms
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:47 pm 
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For the past 10 at least and maybe 15 ... the M-4 has evolved to having the RDS (Reflex Dot Sight) be the primary site ... and the iron sights be the back up (iron) sites ... a.k.a. BUIS (Back Up Iron Sights).

Image

The M68 is the primary dot sight used by the Army. Also known as the Aimpoint. There have been half a zillion different flavors ... but they are all RDS.

So it's not "reflex or red dot" ... it is RDS period.

So, while you are working with your iron sights, you can start thinking about what RDS you want to put on there. Over the past 5.5 years, I've tried everything BUT the Aimpoint, since the Aimpoints are the most expensive. But I expect I will try the Aimpoints one day. I think I am learning maybe they are the best.

The smaller ones, as shown in that pic ... and backup RDS for the main scope. But primarily allow close in shooting ... like out to about 300 yds max. The 3 moa dot in that scope starts to obscure the target beyond 300yds ... and I tried it at 400yds and my 12 inch steel is blotted out. I hold the gun at a 45 degree angle and yes it works because I can put my support elbow on my chest and have bone support.

The Army also used "fixed magnified" optics, like the ACOGs. I briefly had an ACOG ... but sold it because it has no diopter adjustment and for me it was fuzzy at 500yds. I also had an ELCAN 4x/1x it was not fuzzy at 500yds but it cost twice as much as the ACOG, so I sent it back.

So, I pretty much skip over the low power fixed scopes ... LPF ... next after that is the Low Power Variable group .. LPV.

Those include scopes like the Night Force 2.5-10x 42mm ... which is unusual in the LPV class, because it has parallax adjustment. Most of the LPVs do not. I had the Vortex gen2 razor 1-6x MRAD ... and it was a great scope ... super clear glass and a tiny bright red dot in the center for hunting. But it didn't have enough reticle for me to get to 700yds, so I sold it also.

So, I skip over the LPV class also and go up to the medium power variables .. like the 3-15x or 4-16x scopes. These are good for hunting with 3x or 4x on the bottom ... but also good for long distance up to about 1,000yds. This is the class of scope I use the most ... the RDS and then I skip over the medium power variables.

After that are the high power scopes for 1000yds+ .... like the 5-25x or 7-35x ... or 8-40x ... etc. It is often not possible to shoot with magnification much over 20x due to mirage (heat shimmering off the grass) ... hence even when I use these scopes, I usually have them dialed down lower than there maximum power. I do have one of these, but I usually shoot with it between 10x and 20x ... and just use the high power when I using my rifle as a spotting scope. In fact, that's why I got the NightForce 7-35x ... to use it as a rifle scope ... but also as a spotting scope.

==
So, at least given what I'm trying to do ... the RDS work out to 300yds .. .with the more expensive ones working out to 400yds topping out for sure at about 450yds. I skip over the low power fixed and low power variables and go straight to the medium power variables like 3-15 and 4-16 good dual purpose (hunting and target shooting) scopes. These are my primary scopes on my rifles (18 inch barrel and above) ... though my carbines all have RDS (14.5 inch barrel and below). And I have one high power scope I shoot with and use as a spotter on the rifle.

==
I also recommend fewer rounds per session, but more sessions ... I try to shoot 20 rds per day ... 1-2 days a week maybe more ... but 20rds minimum per day ... either groups or dots.

I will try to remember to take a pic of the position I use to shoot the offset RDS.

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 Post subject: Re: Shooting and Firearms
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:52 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Shooting and Firearms
PostPosted: Thu Aug 16, 2018 11:52 pm 
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2018-08-16
2100-2200
70F
5 MPH SW

Goal: Check 5.56(18) at 500yds with SIMRAD

Environment: Storm rolling in from the SW, lightening from the SE all the way around to the NW ... but the wind wasn't blowing too hard yet.

Equipment:
5.56(18) L&S 3-18x T3, SIMRAD kn253, 2 Mags of 10rds each, IMI 77gr, ELIR-3.
M190 tripod, 322rc2 head, pack, 3.2L, first aid, LRF, kestrel, .45ACP, 2 mag of 7rds each, helmet with skeet on left and pvs-14 on right. Garmin 601, pace beads. total weight just over 44 pbs.

Image

Activity: I was going to go on foot tonight and geared up for that, but when I got out there and saw the lightening, I decided to take the 4-wheeler and try to beat the lightening. So rolled out to the turtle creek gate and left it open and rolled on the fastest path, the straight low road out to the main pond, then across the pond damn and up to hill 1309. No cows in sight. Setup the tripod and the gun. Powered up the SIMRAD and the ELIR-3. Cranked the gain to about 30%, first down to zero and then back until the first hint of scintilation. Located the steel target and focused back and forth to get the best image. Dialed the magnification down to 12x and the image was pretty good. Left my phone at home, but remember my DOPE which is 2.9 mils up at 500yds. Dispite the lightening half way around the horizon ... the wind where I was - was still in a lull. So I aiming a little low and left and heard a ping. Repeated 9 times and got 9 more pings. Was feeling a few drops ... packed up and rolled down to the targets. Now I saw my heifers, steers and grandma (the older adult female) in the SW pasture on the other side of the pond. COntinued to the target and counted the 10 hits. I'll have to roll out and take pic tomorrow. Now it was starting to rain (which is really good, we need that). Rolled back towards home, past the cows. Didn't want to distract them, wanted them to be heading for the woods, so went by fast ... used the skeet to navigate across turtle creek bridge, it is really dark down there and the thermal trumps the NV to make sure I don't roll off that 15 foot drop ... then closed the gate and home.

Summary/Results: Well, the SIMRAD can get the job done. It is lighter than the PVS-30, controls are easier to reach, I can mount and dismount it with one hand. And 2.5 times cheaper than the PVS-30 ... what do I need a PVS-30 for ?
:)

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 Post subject: Re: Shooting and Firearms
PostPosted: Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:39 am 
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Appendix I

Image

Equipment: From left to right top to bottom
5.56(18) with L&S Mk6 3-18x T3, KN253, ELIR-3
Team Hillary bump with PVS-14, Skeet-IR
Garmin 601, spare .45ACP Mag, spare 5.56 mag, rite rail pad and pen
.45ACP
Pack with water and first aid
Bag with M190 tripod and 322rc2 head, kestreal and LRF

Appendix II

Image

Target pic showing 10 hits from last night
I expect about a 2 MOA spread off the tripod and given that the target is 12 inches wide, we see a 2 MOA spread horizonally, all though at least half of that is me and I did shift the point of aim right and up slightly (I started out aiming low and left). But the verticle spread is almost 4 MOA. Half of that may be me shifting aim, but half of that could be the ammo. This is IMI 77gr and probably not designed of distance shooting. I read last night that people are seeing groups open up at "distance" though reporting hits of IPSC(2/3) at 600-975yds ... though none said how many misses :)
So, I may relate this ammo to "carbine" use ... i.e. under 400yds and mostly under 150yds. Still searching for a viable 77gr cartiridge. I gave up on black hills. Maybe they used to be good in the day, but I have not been impressed with my experience over the past 5 years. I still have 45 rds of 62gr TSX a specialty round I use for hog hunting, but no other BH in the house now, for the first time in eons.

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