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 Post subject: Re: Shooting and Firearms
PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2017 10:24 am 
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First Sergeant

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Well, went out yesterday to try RAPTAR in the field and got "error 1" message for all ranging attempts.
Came back to the house and checked with the viz laser and it was off 1 mil right and 3 mils low.   
I've been told that running it on the front rail does work and I guess I am proving that!    
Getting a scope ring mount that will work with the UTC will be a custom job and will take a month or so at the machine shop (they are usually several weeks behind).   In the mean time, I can try it at night by rezeroing each time I go out, it isn't that hard.

This is not a RAPTAR issue, this is a mounting issue.
The UTC clipon is too high.   The apertures of the RAPTAR do not clear the UTC when mounted with the Badger RAPTAR mounting system.    Not even close.   So will have to make a new Badger like system that is half inch to 1 inch higher.   Next challenge is to try to figure out how much higher.   But 1 inch would do it for sure.   

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 Post subject: Re: Shooting and Firearms
PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 12:43 am 
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First Sergeant

Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:50 pm
Posts: 9907
Location: Eskridge, KS
Reputation points: 12927
2017-12-06
2030-2130
20F
15 MPH NW

Goal: Check lasers

Environment: Cool and windy from the NW with gusts to 20 mph. Stars visible. Moon began to rise near the end of the session.

Equipment: Bump helmet, PVS-14, PAS-29 10mm 1x 320(30), ODIN 17mm 1x 320(30), B850 ir-illuminator, 3 Lumen RGBW viz light. From top to bottom:
.22lr, Laser Max ir-laser, eley 40gr hp subsonic
5.56(10.5), PAQ-4C ir-laser, FM(r) 77gr
5.56(10.3), CQBL-1 ir-laser, FM(r) 77gr

Image

Activity:

Set up three targets on the target board one above the other, 50yd NRA paper targets. All firing from 50yd FP, off tripod using HOG saddle to hold the guns.

5.56(10.5) up first. I was able to co-witness the ir-laser to the already zeroed holosun P515 reflex sight last night. Three round group, 2 inches, 1 in 10, 9 and 8. I aimed by lining up laser to the right and moving in from the right, I could use the vertical string of targets to line up. But I was pulling the trigger a little too early to judge from the results. But this laser was hitting within tolerance. I aimed the laser at objects between 50 and 100yds away and the laser looked much better at distance. It had bloomed up a bit at 50yds but at 100-200yds it was a tiny dot. I did use the ir-illuminator to try to suppress the bloom. The carbine is double zeroed at 50/160 with maximum vertical offset 1.7 inches high at 120yds. And now so is the laser.

5.56(10.3) up second. I had removed the Trijicon mk3 to send it in for 60mm upgrade. This thre round group was off the paper. I will need to mount the Burris 536 scope on it, zero and co-witness the laser and try again. Looked at the laser from a distance it was not as tight a beam as the PAQ-4C, but I think it was brighter.

.22LR(16) up third. Three round group 4 inches to the right, 2 inch group. Checked the laser at distance, it was actually tiny. I'm using a custom kydex cover on this laser and that really helps suppress the bloom. Also, this laser was the smallest on the target. Crazy that the lowest cost laser of the three has the smallest beam over all (of these three anyway, I have three others).

Results/Summary: Well only the PAQ-4C is within tolerance, that's because I was able to co-witness it last night. The others haven't had zero checked in a year. I will zero the Burris AR-536 scope on the 5.56(10.3) and then co-witness the CQBL to the scope. Then will move the scope to the .22lr (where it will stay). While the Mk3 is out, I'll be practicing up with the lasers.

I've never used exactly this setup on the helmet with the ODIN on the left eye and the 14/PAS-29 on the right eye, but it worked. I'm not used to nucing the ODIN with my left hand and that will take some more practice. Otherwise, everything worked fine.

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 Post subject: Re: Shooting and Firearms
PostPosted: Sun Dec 10, 2017 9:55 pm 
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First Sergeant

Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:50 pm
Posts: 9907
Location: Eskridge, KS
Reputation points: 12927
2017-12-10
1830-1900
40F
5 MPH NW

Goal: Check RAPTAR

Environment: clear, stars, no moon, wind from NW.

Equipment: 5.56(18), L&S 3-18x H58, PVS-14 mounted on rear of scope, later, UTC-x mounted in front. Manfrotto m055 tripod with 322RC-2 head.

The pic shows all the gear but the UTC was not mounted during the zeroing process.

Image

Activity:

STEP01 - Zero ir-laser to the reticle.
I had already zeroed the day scope at 100yds. Badger finally sent me the correct screws to mount the RAPTAR mount to the scope rings, so I did that and mounted the RAPTAR, testing in the house revealed the lasers could all see past the bell of the UTC. In the RAPTAR the three lasers, the red viz, the ir-pointer and the LRF laser all shine thru the same aperture. Though from slightly different positions.
So I had zeroed the xiz laser to the reticle in the house. That gets it close enough that when you go outside and try to zero the ir-laser at longer distance you can see it in the FOV of the scope.
When mounted at 12 o'clock on top of the scope, the adjustments just happen to work just like most day scopes. Counter clock wise on the knob on the top of the RAPTAR is "up" CW is down. For the knob on the side, turning the top of the knob towards you is right and top of the knob away is left. So this is easy to remember! So, I powered on the 14. I pointed the reticle at a mineral feeder I knew to be 415yds away and cranked the magnification all the way up to 18x. I set the selector switch on the RAPTAR to IR-laser, which is one click CCW from off. Then adjusted the ir-laser on to the center of the reticle on the mineral feeder. I Had attached the pressure switch, so I was using that to turn the laser on/off. Then I hit the range button and read 378 and did a little arithmetic and got 415 yds ! Further more, I could SEE the distance on the back of the display with my left eye, without taking my right eye off the reticle on the target. I had not expected that !!!.
I then checked a tree at 74 meters and another tree at 91 meters.

STEP02 - Test with the thermal clipon
Then I removed the 14 assembly from the back of the day scope.
And I mounted the UTC-x to the front. I use larue rail clips, so I can feel the top to start the
I re-lased the mineral feeder. This time, my eye was a little closer to the back of the scope and I could not quite see over the top of the turrets. I rechecked the two trees and they matched. So I was lasing targets with the RAPTAR with the UTC clipped on giving me 18x with the H58 reticle. This was the goal !

I need to take it out to the pasture at our highest point, were I can lase a known object at 770yds

Results/Summary: L&S says they will replace the M5B2 turrets I have for the M5C2 turrets for $220. The C2 turrets are lower, I bet I'll be able to see over them. I might do that upgrade. I was thinking about it anyway since I do not like the B2 elevation turret.

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 Post subject: Re: Shooting and Firearms
PostPosted: Fri Dec 15, 2017 12:14 pm 
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Sergeant Major
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:50 pm
Posts: 29082
Location: West coast of the east coast
Reputation points: 20000
jwilkerson wrote:
2017-12-10
1830-1900
40F
5 MPH NW

Goal: Check RAPTAR

Environment: clear, stars, no moon, wind from NW.

Equipment: 5.56(18), L&S 3-18x H58, PVS-14 mounted on rear of scope, later, UTC-x mounted in front. Manfrotto m055 tripod with 322RC-2 head.

The pic shows all the gear but the UTC was not mounted during the zeroing process.

Image

Activity:

STEP01 - Zero ir-laser to the reticle.
I had already zeroed the day scope at 100yds. Badger finally sent me the correct screws to mount the RAPTAR mount to the scope rings, so I did that and mounted the RAPTAR, testing in the house revealed the lasers could all see past the bell of the UTC. In the RAPTAR the three lasers, the red viz, the ir-pointer and the LRF laser all shine thru the same aperture. Though from slightly different positions.
So I had zeroed the xiz laser to the reticle in the house. That gets it close enough that when you go outside and try to zero the ir-laser at longer distance you can see it in the FOV of the scope.
When mounted at 12 o'clock on top of the scope, the adjustments just happen to work just like most day scopes. Counter clock wise on the knob on the top of the RAPTAR is "up" CW is down. For the knob on the side, turning the top of the knob towards you is right and top of the knob away is left. So this is easy to remember! So, I powered on the 14. I pointed the reticle at a mineral feeder I knew to be 415yds away and cranked the magnification all the way up to 18x. I set the selector switch on the RAPTAR to IR-laser, which is one click CCW from off. Then adjusted the ir-laser on to the center of the reticle on the mineral feeder. I Had attached the pressure switch, so I was using that to turn the laser on/off. Then I hit the range button and read 378 and did a little arithmetic and got 415 yds ! Further more, I could SEE the distance on the back of the display with my left eye, without taking my right eye off the reticle on the target. I had not expected that !!!.
I then checked a tree at 74 meters and another tree at 91 meters.

STEP02 - Test with the thermal clipon
Then I removed the 14 assembly from the back of the day scope.
And I mounted the UTC-x to the front. I use larue rail clips, so I can feel the top to start the
I re-lased the mineral feeder. This time, my eye was a little closer to the back of the scope and I could not quite see over the top of the turrets. I rechecked the two trees and they matched. So I was lasing targets with the RAPTAR with the UTC clipped on giving me 18x with the H58 reticle. This was the goal !

I need to take it out to the pasture at our highest point, were I can lase a known object at 770yds

Results/Summary: L&S says they will replace the M5B2 turrets I have for the M5C2 turrets for $220. The C2 turrets are lower, I bet I'll be able to see over them. I might do that upgrade. I was thinking about it anyway since I do not like the B2 elevation turret.



Had Wilkerson lived in the 1700's:

Image

;)

[I cannot take credit for creating that pic. I saw it at Ace of Spades HQ)

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 Post subject: Re: Shooting and Firearms
PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:45 pm 
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First Sergeant

Joined: Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:49 pm
Posts: 9921
Reputation points: 17020
If JW ever 'loses it' he'll kill everything w/in 2 miles of im. If the zombie apocalypse hits I'm moving in w/ im. I can't shoot as good but I can tote im more ammo.

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 Post subject: Re: Shooting and Firearms
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 12:17 am 
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First Sergeant

Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:50 pm
Posts: 9907
Location: Eskridge, KS
Reputation points: 12927
I like the RAPTAR so much, I got two baby brother radiae. One for my shooting buddy and a backup for me.

Image

Though the RAPTAR has an ir-laser and the Radius has a viz laser, I zeroed the Radius to the scope reticle using the same process I used for the RAPTAR.

01 - Mount Radius on the 12 o'clock mount over the scope
02 - Activate vis laser in the house.
03 - Co-witness to the scope reticle.
04 - Mount the 14 scope adapter and the PVS-14 on rear of scope.
05 - Move everything out side and setup.
06 - Turn on the 14
07 - Aim at mineral feeder 415 yds away.
08 - co-witness the laser to the scope reticle.
09 - Check the distance = 416yds
10 - Check distance to fence post = 77yds (check)
11 - Check distance to telephone pole = 106yds (check)

It works!

And just like with the RAPTAR, with my eye still on the target, I can see the distance with my other eye without moving.

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 Post subject: Re: Shooting and Firearms
PostPosted: Mon Jan 29, 2018 11:13 pm 
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First Sergeant

Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:50 pm
Posts: 9907
Location: Eskridge, KS
Reputation points: 12927
Finally got a PVS-30 to replace the CO-LR that died back in Sept 2015 ... 28 months without!

So L&S 3-18x Tremor-3 with PVS-30 on the 6.5G(18)
and Burris xtr2 3-15x scr-mil with UTCx on the 5.56(18)

Image

RAPTAR LRF on the 3-18x
Radius LRF on the 3-15x

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 Post subject: Re: Shooting and Firearms
PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 9:44 pm 
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First Sergeant

Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:50 pm
Posts: 9907
Location: Eskridge, KS
Reputation points: 12927
Israeli green tip on sale for 27 cents a round !!!

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/266013/imi-ammunition-556x45mm-nato-62-grain-m855-ss109-penetrator-full-metal-jacket-boat-tail-box-of-450-15-boxes-of-30

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 Post subject: Re: Shooting and Firearms
PostPosted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:36 am 
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First Sergeant

Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:50 pm
Posts: 9907
Location: Eskridge, KS
Reputation points: 12927
2018-02-09

2018-02-10

1700-0500

20F

15 MPH N



Goals: Hogs and Yotes



Environment:

Friday: 76F when we arrived, quickly down to 21F with winds 20-25 MPG from N

Large Fields, 0.5 to 1 mile per side, very flat and open terrain, Cows, Deer, Yotes, Pigs, Coons, Skunks.

Saturday: Temps in the 20s all day and night. Winds a little lower 15 MPH N.



Team and Equipment:

Dave: Pulsar Quantum, 50mm, 384, 6.5(16), Trail 640, 50mm, 123 SST, Ram 1500

James: 5.56(10.5), Pulsar APEX 50mm, 384, 62gr TSX, PVS-14, PAS-29, Bushy LRF

Joe: 5.56(10.3), Mk3 60mm, Patrol, PVS-14, 62gr TSX



Activity:



Friday:

Rolling and scanning fields near WF, TX

Wind conditions and distances involved made PID difficult. Smaller scanners could detect, but often I would hear calls to "Put the big one on it", meaning fire up the 60mm and try to PID.

A number of initial mis-identifications were made, but eventually corrected with additional study.

No critters were taken Friday night. All the pigs we saw were in fields we could not shoot.



Saturday:

Rolling and scanning fields in Mantag Cty, TX

More hills and trees, but still fairly large fields.

We got one boar. I spotted it from several hundred yards distance and eventually we were able to stalk up to it.

James knocked it down with 1 shot from 125yds.



Image



As we closed up to drag it to the truck, it was still moving. The shot had completely paralyzed the 2 front legs, but the rear ones were still moving.

We gave it a mercy shot.

Had to drag it up a hill and put it on the truck. Girth was 42.5 inches, so est. 225 pds.

Later on that same property we missed when shooting at another group of hogs. Not knowing the distance caused us to aim high. We learned from that to measure the distance before each emgagememt.



Back in WF, we revisted the proerties from previous night.

We were rolling through one field stopping and scanning. James had my Patrol and 14 on his head from right rear seat. He called out "something moving 5 p'clock to 3 o'clock.

I was scanning out front right seat with 60mm and called "yote with no tail". I had never seen a yote with no tail, but that is what I saw, so I called it out.

Dave, out of vehicle scanning with 50mm called "tail is tucked".

I asked James to give distances. Using LRF and 14 he was able to provide several range updates over the next few minutes.

Dave tried calling it, but that caused it to move away more quickly.

He tried calling it again and it laid down facing us.

James called out 205yds. My hold was 6 inches up at that distance.

Dave said "Pop it". I timed breathing to put reticle six inches over neck at top of breathing cycle and fired.

Yote rolled over, legs in air.

Dave and James could not see it clearly but I called out it was dead.

Turned out the hit was 2 inches under the left ear.



Image



Later we decided, the yote realized it was "cornered" and went to ground as a defensive measure.



We saw a group of about 10 pigs in a field we could not shoot, but just across the road from a field we could shoot.

We stalked into the field we could shoot and tried to call the pigs from 100yds. No reaction.

Closed to 75yds called again. No reaction

Closed to 50yds called again. No reaction

Closed to 25yds called again. The pigs ran in the opposite direction. :D



Not a great night for calling !



Rolling, James detected something about 500yds in a field. WIth 60mm on 9x I thought it was a pig, but was not sure as it was end on.

We rolled another 50yds and it turned, still end on. We repeated 3 more times with it continuing to turn as we moved. Eventually I called PID on pig.

We rolled in to the field and stalked final 300yds to 100yds, lased the distance and fired with no hold and got this lone boar. It was smaller than the previous one. It did not detect us.



Image



By then it was 5am again.



==

Summary: Knowing the distances to the critters in the large fields is critical as there are no landmarks.

The patrol, in its first outing, was very useful, though we used it on 2x most of the time, but it still had a very clear image.

The 14 and LRF were very useful at providing distances.

The best long distance spotter we had was the 60mm Mk3, which still had a good image on 9x.

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 Post subject: Re: Shooting and Firearms
PostPosted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 11:56 am 
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fire up the 60mm..... For a minute I thought you were using a mortar on the bastards. Now that would be a fun way to hunt hogs!!!

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