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 Post subject: Re: EU and Brexit
PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 12:50 pm 
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mdiehl wrote:
So, basically the EU would treat the UK the way it treats the USA? All the protectionism that the EU can squeeze into the gaps in the WTO rules at least for the 15 years it takes for the WTO to rule against them and for the appeals to run their course?


Well, yes, though what is forecast is far more apocalyptic than that.

Quote:
This could be a seed for a REAL transatlantic "alliance" rather than the nudge-nudge wink-wink bullshit exercise in unilateral wealth transfer from the US to the EU that is in place at present.


It could, but given how the Left here seems to despise the USA (You wouldn't believe some of the bullshit I've heard regarding free trade with the US) it would unfortunately seem rather doubtful, though I'd be all for it.

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 Post subject: Re: EU and Brexit
PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2018 1:17 pm 
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Make Toblerone great again...

Quote:
Makers of the Swiss chocolate bar, Toblerone, are to scrap its latest incarnation which saw wide gaps between its distinctive triangular chunks.

That version was introduced in 2016 to reduce its weight but drew criticism, with some likening it to a bike rack.

US-based Mondelez International said the new shape had not been a "perfect long-term answer" for its customers.

Now it plans to increase the current size from 150g to 200g and revert to making it in its traditional shape.

When the downsized version was first released, the makers blamed a rise in the cost of ingredients and said they had to make a decision between changing the look or raising the price.

But the new widely-spaced triangles in the lighter bar left fans feeling cheated.

On Toblerone's Facebook page, Louise Bennett wrote: "After a busy day at work I decided to treat myself. I was super excited, until I opened it and discovered half of the pieces missing!"

And Scott Blackadder wrote: "I was eating mine today and lost my shoe. I found it in one of the gaps in my Toblerone."

Asked whether falling sales were behind the return to the original shape, Mondelez said sales of the 150g bar increased after the shape was changed and 2017 was a "fantastic year" for Toblerone.

Manufacturing has now ceased on 150g bars, the firm added.

It is unclear what the retail price will be of the new 200g bar, due to be on the shelves later this year.

Toblerones also come in 100g bars, which retail at £1.63, and in 360g bars for £5.49.

On Friday, Mondelez, which owns Cadbury, said Dairy Milk bars containing 30% less sugar would go on sale from next year after the government challenged the food industry to cut sugar levels.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-44910195

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 Post subject: Re: EU and Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2018 4:14 pm 
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Say bye to John Cleese, U.K. He is sick of the PC nonsense


Here is the full interview

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 Post subject: Re: EU and Brexit
PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 7:23 am 
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... Irish Foreign Minister Simon Coveney has warned that the UK "cannot afford" to leave the EU without a deal. ...


I 5000% disagree.

The first rule of negotiation is "you can't negotiate, if you can't walk away" ... I would be surprised if poly tikians don't realize that ...

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 Post subject: Re: EU and Brexit
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 10:36 am 
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This article from the Sunday Times:

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news ... -dz3359lrf

Quote:
Army on standby for no-deal Brexit emergency

Tim Shipman, Political Editor
July 29 2018, 12:01am,
The Sunday Times

Ministers have drawn up plans to send in the army to deliver food, medicines and fuel in the event of shortages if Britain crashes out of the EU without a deal.

Blueprints for the armed forces to assist the civilian authorities, usually used only in civil emergencies, have been dusted down as part of the “no deal” planning.

Helicopters and army trucks would be used to ferry supplies to vulnerable people outside the southeast who were struggling to obtain the medicines they needed.

Helicopters would be used to ferry supplies to vulnerable peopleHelicopters would be used to ferry supplies to vulnerable people
In today’s Business section, it is revealed that supermarkets are warning their suppliers to stockpile supplies such as tea and coffee.

The NHS would go on a year-round “winter crisis footing”, with drugs bought from outside the EU and stockpiled in hospitals.

The revelations will spark renewed claims from Brexiteers that the government is engaged in scaremongering about Brexit.

An investigation of no-deal planning found that Steve Baker, the minister then in charge of the issue, threatened to resign in March because Downing Street was refusing to publicise the preparations being made.

An assessment of the cost of a no deal on the rest of the EU, which he demanded, has never been used in negotiations.

A minister said the military would be called in if blockages at ports led to shortages of food, fuel and medicines, warning: “There is a lot of civil contingency planning around the prospect of no deal. That’s not frightening the horses, that’s just being utterly realistic.”

A Ministry of Defence source said “no formal request” to supply aid had been received but acknowledged that “a blueprint for us supporting the civilian authorities that can be dusted off”.

Plans to publish reports throughout the summer on no-deal planning have been ditched because of fears they would alarm the public. They will be released on the same day in late August.

Amber Rudd, the former home secretary, has compared Brexiteers to climate change deniers. Writing in The Sunday Times, she says: “Anyone who claims [Brexit] will be easy is being as cavalier with people’s future as those who deny the belching of fossil fuels into the atmosphere is warming the planet.”



I suppose that the US would do its part to help but the size of its merchant fleet is miniscule:

Quote:
As of 31 December 2016, the United States merchant fleet had 175 privately owned, oceangoing, self-propelled vessels of 1,000 gross register tons and above that carry cargo from port to port. One hundred fourteen (114) were dry cargo ships, and 61 were tankers. Ninety seven (97) were Jones Act eligible, and 78 were non-Jones Act eligible. MARAD deemed 152 of the 175 vessels "militarily useful."[

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_St ... ine#Fleets

Here is another source that provides additional details:

https://www.bts.gov/content/number-and- ... orld-fleet

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 Post subject: Re: EU and Brexit
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 10:46 am 
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I suspect though that US tea would not be such a big hit in Britain. ;-)

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 Post subject: Re: EU and Brexit
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 5:00 pm 
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The media right now here is basically this ->



:roll:

They must be dropping like flies in Australia.

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 Post subject: Re: EU and Brexit
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 6:51 pm 
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EUBanana wrote:
The media right now here is basically this ->



:roll:

They must be dropping like flies in Australia.


The funny thing about propaganda blitzes (IMHO): they tend to fire up those who are already convinced; they tend to perk up suspicions among those who are 'almost convinced' (which might sway them into the unconvinced segment); they especially tend to perk up suspicions among those who are 'almost unconvinced.' And of course, they just don't do anything 'good' (from the standpoint of the propagandists) about/for/with 'enemies.' Propaganda almost seems to be encouraging to actual enemies.

Whenever propaganda is pervasive, subtle, omnipresent, consistently suggestive but not preachy: THAT can work wonders, although it will still never convince everyone. The pro-WWII propaganda which the U.S. engaged in seems to have been pretty effective, though actively measuring 'efficacy' is a real problem, that would be a good example of the latter approach.

But launching "propaganda offensives" within populations which are already splintered if not contentious: I'd say unlikely to achieve desired effects, might well cause a higher ratio of undesired effects, and is generally a sign of desperation.

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 Post subject: Re: EU and Brexit
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 10:21 pm 
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Quote:
Whenever propaganda is pervasive, subtle, omnipresent, consistently suggestive but not preachy: THAT can work wonders, although it will still never convince everyone. The pro-WWII propaganda which the U.S. engaged in seems to have been pretty effective, though actively measuring 'efficacy' is a real problem, that would be a good example of the latter approach.



I’m not sure what level of pro- ww2 propaganda there was before The Pearl Harbor attack, or how effective that it was, but my impression is that once news of that hit the radios, you didn’t really need much propaganda to convince people on the need to go to war. The heavy lifting of convincing people was done once the attack was announced.
IIrC there was only one Congressman that voted against a declaration of war.

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 Post subject: Re: EU and Brexit
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 12:20 am 
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chijohnaok wrote:
Quote:
Whenever propaganda is pervasive, subtle, omnipresent, consistently suggestive but not preachy: THAT can work wonders, although it will still never convince everyone. The pro-WWII propaganda which the U.S. engaged in seems to have been pretty effective, though actively measuring 'efficacy' is a real problem, that would be a good example of the latter approach.



I’m not sure what level of pro- ww2 propaganda there was before The Pearl Harbor attack, or how effective that it was, but my impression is that once news of that hit the radios, you didn’t really need much propaganda to convince people on the need to go to war. The heavy lifting of convincing people was done once the attack was announced.
IIrC there was only one Congressman that voted against a declaration of war.


I think you are right, and no I don't think there was "much" pro-war propaganda before the war. Generally pro-war sentiments were kept relatively hush-hush until Pearl Harbor I think.

So yes, I agree with your point that, the Pearl Harbor attack seems to have been the 'most' important factor in driving public support for that war. If memory serves, the enlistment facilities of the country were maxed out for a couple of years.

But another important part of that propaganda effort was to promote the endurance necessary for people to make all the sacrifices and to stick through till the end. The propaganda effort was extremely pervasive and much of Hollywood, the music industry, the arts and industry were cooperative. I had a grad student whose committee I sat on who did her MA thesis on WWII propaganda, so most of what I'm saying comes form having read her thesis (which could be in error, because no, I didn't track down and verify all her sources!).

All this to say: propaganda CAN be very effective, when you do it right. Mounting an obvious blitz at the 11th hour in a period of crisis and transition is almost never the right way to do it, at least not when dealing with a topic on which the population is quite divided.

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